Can there be any 'turbulence' that goes undetected by the radar of an airbus plane?

Question

There was recently a problem on flight MK 641 of Air Mauritius to Hong Kong. Some passengers do not agree with the version of Air Mauritius that turbulence was the cause. they say there could have been problems with the navigation system of the plane. Refer to: http://www.lexpress.mu/display_search_result.php?news_id=92986
and
http://www.lexpress.mu/display_search_result.php?news_id=93156

Answer 1

I don't speak French well enough to understand either link, however no turbulance is visibal on any radar. Turbulance is a lot like white water rapids. With rapids, it is still water, but it is bumpy fast moving water. Turbulance is bumpy air. Radar is simply a radio wave that gets sent out, hits something (be it metal, animal or some nut in a lawn chair with attached baloons and bounces back to the radar site. Since turbulance is air, if air forced radar waves back to the radar site, then radar returns wouldn't get past a micron away from the radar dish. That is why you cannot locate turbulance on radar. CAT (clear air turbulance) can even strike severely without the pilot anticipating.

Radar does reflect heavy concentrations of water droplets such as you'd find in dense clouds. Most advanced aircraft have equipment that can detect lightening strikes and the rule of thumb is to stay 20 nautical miles away from those storm clouds.

So to answer your question directly, no turbulance can be detected by any equipment of an Airbus, Boeing or any other aircraft. The pilot might have some idea that you will encounter turbulance, but that is only a hunch.

Answer 2

The first answer is absolutely correct. Weather radar does not and can not detect turbulence. It detects weather. It has to have something to reflect off of and turbulence is only air currents. Many people associate turbulence with thunderstorms but it can and does often occur in clear air. That is what is know as Clear Air Turbulence (CAT). This is undetectable outside of a pilot report from a preceding aircraft.

Answer 3

You can't see clear air turbulence on a Radar but Rockwell Collins has a new radar out that can detect turbulence in precipitation environments.

Direct Measure of Turbulence
Using the Doppler principle of frequency shift, the
Collins TWR-850 is capable of detecting precipitationrelated
turbulence at ranges up to 50 nautical miles. In
addition to identifying turbulence in and around areas
of heavy precipitation, the system can detect and
display turbulence in areas of light precipitation, such
as in a building thunderstorm where safe flight may
otherwise be expected. It can even detect turbulence
in areas where the rainfall intensity is below the green
threshold established for light rainfall (0.8 mm/hr).

Answer 4

There are radar systems now that DO detect turbulence. I have one in my plane. As said the radar actually detects water droplets in clouds or rain. The way the turbulence mode works is by detecting the MOVEMENT of the water drops. So it can only "see" turbulence if there is sufficient water in the area. The one on my plane is limited to 50 miles out for turbulence detection and it shows groups of small megenta dots where it predicts turbelence will be. The are many causes of turbulence other than convective weather and it doesn't help for those types of turbulence. see below link for description of turbulence detection radar:
http://www.rockwellcollins.com/content/pdf/pdf_8327.pdf

Answer 5

Ok Using my Limited french, what the pax are basically saying is that the weather radar should detect turbulence 5-10 minutes ahead of the plane.

As said very well above Radar does not detect turbulence. Turbulence is basically diffrent air currents. It's all around us. Thermal instability resulting from un eeven heating of diffrent surfaces, Updrafts and down drafts from clouds, local wind patterns, wind flowing over ubstroctions, etc. Passangers often get a cause in there mind and stick to it. However impratical it may be.

Answer 6

Turbulance is airpockets...HOWEVER

If there is significant weather like clouds, etc., yes those will show up on radar, and most pilots can use common sense and know that if there is a system with LARGE vertical development, there will be turbulance. But if they are in a clear sky day, there is really no way in determining turbulance by the radar...if you know a way, please let me know, we'll go into business and makes lot's of money. haha...

Answer 7

Obviously radar cannot see air, and there isnt any way to detect winds aloft over water, so how the hell could they possibly have any idea of wind sheer and turbulence besides PIREPS?
If the navigation system had gone down, they would have used radar vectors, so it doesnt matter either way.
I hate these conspiracies that know it all nobodies make up.

Answer 8

There are a number of factors that could have happened but flying at high altitude does pose the risk of encountering CAT = clear air turbulance in high level jet streams!

If you do a search on the internet you will learn all about them.

Answer 9

The weather radar should have been able to see the turbulence IF and ONLY IF there was enough moisture in the air, otherwise it won't see anything.

Answer 10

Clear air turbulence. It's a bummer!