How do I define evil if there is no God...?

Question

I don't know how many times I have been asked, “If there is no God, how can there be right or wrong?” Let me ask you this Christians. How can there be right or wrong even if God does exist. All God does is judge us humans. He decides what’s right and what’s wrong on Earth, but who does God have to answer to??? Who judges God??? According to you Christians, he doesn't have to answer to anyone. Before God created us, he was in the same position we atheists are in now. He was just something that existed all by himself with no divine moral compass to follow. He, like us atheists, had to define right from wrong without a divine moral compass. Which leads me to believe that even if there was a God, right and wrong is totally based on personal opinion, not a divine power.

Answer 1

Without God there is no moral absolute and your idea of good is equal to anyone elses.

Answer 2

Why Christians Must Steal From Secular Morality:
http://www.caseagainstfaith.com/submissions/steal_morality.htm
Christians must steal their moral rules from secular morality. They have no choice, as the Bible does not offer a moral system, it only offers a series of contradictory commands and a supposed threat of punishment in the "afterlife" for not following them - a punishment that is given equally to all violators - whatever the sin.

The Bible does nothing and can do nothing towards inculcating moral behavior on its own. Christians must steal from secular moral systems, and then merely graft their 'God threats' on top of this moral system. This is necessary. And the reason for this is simple: there is no morality in the Bible and there can be no morality in the Bible, because the Bible holds that 1) ALL 'sins' are equivalent (destroying any moral sense) AND 2) all moral behavior is immaterial, because works cannot save a person, AND finally all people are damned from birth.

In reality, Christians realize that some actions are more moral than others. They realize that moral actions exist in a hierarchy, and that rape is far worse than stealing a pencil. Yet the Bible holds that all 'sins' are equal, as all deserve the same punishment.

Christians also realize that humans can be moral agents... they expect moral behavior from others, and they view their own children as something to value. Yet the Bible holds that man is worthless, that he cannot be a moral agent, and that his sole salvation comes from grace. However, since Christians realize, implicitly, that all of these these points are obviously, prima facie false, they must steal from secular systems, that hold that 1) man obviously has a value 2) all 'sins' are obviously not equivalent and 3) a person cannot be held to be doing anything 'immoral' without intent.

Answer 3

It depends upon your understanding of God.

What makes you think that God has "no divine moral compass to follow"? Is it really possible that Someone who expects you to follow rules will not Himself follow them? Do teachers/parents follow rules while asking their students/children to follow them?

Who judges God? His creatures. He has to show by His own example. There are some things where we know what is right and what is wrong without God telling us because we are "created in His image" - so we bear a resemblence to His nature. We naturally know right from wrong. But there are other things that need reminding and His clear instructions. Hope this helps.

Answer 4

Consider that there is not objective Good or Evil. Rather, there is helpful and not-helpful. And each of these are defined in context.

The 9-11 hijackers were using religion as a way of justifying their actions. There was nothing helpful about these acts, but from a God-Based morality, it was good.

This is only to say that there is no morality separate from the context, and it can only be judged from its benefits to the people involved. We are moral creatures, but studies among primates suggest that a lot of our morality is quasi-instinctual. You may think that is God-given, but I think evidence suggests it is simply an evolutionary artifact of our social nature of human beings.

^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^

Answer 5

The problem with your logic is that you miss one very important fact:

We are finite, and our understanding is finite, and our decisions can be based on faulty information.

God, on the other hand, is infinite, with infinite understanding ("God knows the beginning from the end" - which to me, means that God us fully aware of the end results, or the consequences, of any decision), so He does not fall into the trap of making a decision with faulty information. God knows everything knowable, and He is sane.

Look at it like this - I assume you are sane. Ok? If somebody handed you a loaded pistol, knowing and understanding the consequences, would you point that pistol at your own head and pull the trigger? I would assume that because you ARE sane, you would NOT pull the trigger, because you understand the consequences.

God knows the end results of EVERY possible choice and decision, so He knows what actions and choices will lead to moral failure and which ones won't, and it is based on this knowledge that He knows right from wrong.

Of course, the other thought on this is that morality IS based on God's basic nature and character, and anything that violates the nature and character of God, or the image of God He put within each of us, then THAT is the basis for what is sin and what is NOT sin - Who and what He is.

For instance, God is Truth, so telling a lie is sin.

And, God is faithful, so infidelity between a married couple is sin.

Etc.

In one case, morality is absolute based on absolute knowledge and understanding.

In the other case, morality is absolute and based on God's nature and character.

So, while your logic holds, your premise is wrong, so your conclusion is wrong.

Answer 6

assuming of course there is such a thing as right and wrong. Should I just have faith right and wrong exist? the fact that they are words in our language, does that mean they are real?

You define evil as your self as all us Atheists do after all; we are heathens for even having the audacity to think outside the box.

You are not good, so you are not what to be, so yah, dont be yourself, only be what they are, and then you'll understand what Evil is, b/c you'll look back and think "what was I doing even thinking to begin with, that only caused more trouble then it solved, so therefore THINKING is evil".

and I digress.

Answer 7

You are correct... Even if god existed, the existence of he or she or they would not define good or evil anyway...

Copying from an answer I gave a while back -

Assume that God does what is good. Is it good because God does it, or does God do it because it is good?

If the first, then anything at all could be deemed "good" simply because God does it.

If the latter - if God does things that are intrisically good - then goodness does not depend on God.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Aokjz9uZQtisTxnChPAyju3ty6IX?qid=20070803215146AA29nGo&show=7#profile-info-6064bd72a9d33a8f2e618cc79b0f9629aa

Answer 8

Lets see... consider for the moment, as you have noted, that on this planet there exists one and one only! In fact consider you are the only one aware being in all existence in all time in all the universe. There must have been a first?

Now if it is only you here alone by yourself are you going to do yourself harm?
Are you going to do evil things?
To whom are you going to be evil?
Who will judge you?

Given the choice you would probably decide to be creative and talk to yourself?
What do you think?
what could you think?

Most find it difficult to even consider these questions, just remember how good you truly are :-)

Answer 9

God was never alone! God had his son with him. two females called wisdom and understanding. And a host of Angels on an assignment. God was celebrated in heaven and praised. He had all that he desired. He made us to love and be loved by him. God was always right. Lucifer is the one that made things wrong. Isaiah 14:12-19. A fallen Angel the envy of all heaven because he was minstrel of music,he was beautiful with pipes in his back and jewels covering him. Sapphires,diamonds,emeralds,rubies, jade all kinds of jewels. He was a bad boy until he thought he wanted to rise above the master of life. God! He had a following but they to was cast out with him. Then he could not wait to trip with Eve.

Answer 10

i think god answers to us. We deceide which different gods to believe in and we have the power to change our beliefs throughout our life. Good cannot exist without evil and vice-versa for nitchki said how can we fully see if something is good if we do not have evil to compare it to. right and wrong are subjective things, i'm not an evil person but what i got upto last weekend was not good, but was good for me, you might think i'm an evil person doomed to hell, but thats your own personal opion and you have the divine power to know, understand,forgive and accept.....That is something we seem unable to credit god with.

Answer 11

I take your question to be, why do we need God to define evil, right? We don't. God by is own standard cannot do evil and thus doesn't even know evil. Thats something created by people without Gods guidance.