Outside of the religious books/manuals, what are the historic references that verify Jesus' existence?

Question

Are there any historical records or anything about a human male doing such wondrous things? I mean he did some pretty great stuff and that would probably be on record somewhere yes?

david---historical records, not "followers" diaries.

judy--the question was regarding "religious" books...you've gone on a tangent.

"If Jesus did not exist, why do people use his name in vain?"

No comment.

Answer 1

Historical References to Jesus

http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/mara.html

A Letter of Mara, Son of Serapion

Mara, son of Serapion, to Serapion, my son: peace.…..For what benefit did the Athenians obtain by putting Socrates to death, seeing that they received as retribution for it famine and pestilence? Or the people of Samos by the burning of Pythagoras, seeing that in one hour the. whole19 of their country was covered with sand? Or the Jews by the murder of their Wise King, seeing that from that very time their kingdom was driven away from them? For with justice did God grant a recompense to the wisdom of all three of them. For the Athenians died by famine; and the people of Samos were covered by the sea without remedy; and the Jews, brought to desolation and expelled from their kingdom, are driven away into Every land. Nay, Socrates did "not" die, because of Plato; nor yet Pythagoras, because of the statue of Hera; nor yet the Wise King, because of the new laws which he enacted.

http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/talmud.html

Here is what is written in Baraitha Bab. Sanhedrin 43a, probably second century:

On the eve of Passover Yeshu was hanged. For forty days before the execution took place, a herald went forth and cried, "He is going forth to be stoned because he has practiced sorcery and enticed Israel to apostasy. Any one who can say anything in his favour, let him come forward and plead on his behalf." But since nothing was brought forward in his favour he was hanged on the eve of the Passover! - Ulla retorted: Do you suppose that he was one for whom a defence could be made? Was he not a _Mesith_ [enticer], concerning him Scripture says, _Neither shalt though spare, neither shalt thou conceal him?_ With Yeshu however it was different, for he was connected with the government for royalty [i.e., influential]. Our Rabbis taught: Yeshu had five disciples, Matthai, Nakai, Nezer, Buni, and Todah.


http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/tacitus.html

The most famous passage in which Tacitus mentions Christianity is as follows (Annals 15.44):
Such indeed were the precautions of human wisdom. The next thing was to seek means of propitiating the gods, and recourse was had to the Sibylline books, by the direction of which prayers were offered to Vulcanus, Ceres, and Proserpina. Juno, too, was entreated by the matrons, first, in the Capitol, then on the nearest part of the coast, whence water was procured to sprinkle the fane and image of the goddess. And there were sacred banquets and nightly vigils celebrated by married women. But all human efforts, all the lavish gifts of the emperor, and the propitiations of the gods, did not banish the sinister belief that the conflagration was the result of an order.
Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular. Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind. Mockery of every sort was added to their deaths. Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illumination, when daylight had expired. Nero offered his gardens for the spectacle, and was exhibiting a show in the circus, while he mingled with the people in the dress of a charioteer or stood aloft on a car. Hence, even for criminals who deserved extreme and exemplary punishment, there arose a feeling of compassion; for it was not, as it seemed, for the public good, but to glut one man's cruelty, that they were being destroyed.

http://www.allabouthistory.org/josephus-and-christ-faq.htm

Josephus mentions Jesus in Antiquities, Book 18, chapter 3, paragraph 3 (this paragraph is so phenomenal, that scholars now debate the authenticity of some of the more "favorable" portions of this text):

"Now there was about this time Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man; for he was a doer of wonderful works, a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews and many of the Gentiles. He was [the] Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again the third day; as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him, are not extinct at this day."

http://www.christian-thinktank.com/jrthal.html

Julius Africanus quoting --Thallus (c. 50-75ad)

On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down. This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun. For the Hebrews celebrate the passover on the 14th day according to the moon, and the passion of our Savior falls on the day before the passover; but an eclipse of the sun takes place only when the moon comes under the sun. And it cannot happen at any other time but in the interval between the first day of the new moon and the last of the old, that is, at their junction: how then should an eclipse be supposed to happen when the moon is almost diametrically opposite the sun? Let opinion pass however; let it carry the majority with it; and let this portent of the world be deemed an eclipse of the sun, like others a portent only to the eye. Phlegon records that, in the time of Tiberius Caesar, at full moon, there was a full eclipse of the sun from the sixth hour to the ninth--manifestly that one of which we speak. But what has an eclipse in common with an earthquake, the rending rocks, and the resurrection of the dead, and so great a perturbation throughout the universe? Surely no such event as this is recorded for a long period. (XVIII.1)

http://www.provethebible.net/T2-Divin/D-0201.htm

Lucian, the Greek satirist, wrote this rather scathing attack in The Death of Peregrine circa AD 170:

The Christians, you know, worship a man to this day - the distinguished personage who introduced their novel rites, and was crucified on that account... You see, these misguided creatures start with the general conviction that they are immortal for all time, which explains the contempt of death and voluntary self-devotion which are so common among them; and then it was impressed upon them by their original lawgiver that they are all brothers, from the moment that they are converted, and deny the gods of Greece, and worship the crucified sage, and live after his laws.

Answer 2

I didn't see the Kerrang 100 list so I don't know if yours is better BUT I can't agree with any rock list that doesn't have Foghat in the top 100 somewhere. Foghat was one of the best rock bands ever and should be in at least the top 20! The Scorpions, The Kinks, Ten Years After, Jethro Tull, Credence Clearwater Revival, Frank Zappa, Krokus, Dokken, Tesla, and Foreigner should also be on the list before The Cars or Styx!

Answer 3

Give me a small army to overtake the Vatican guard, and I'll get you all the evidence you could ever want. A good friend of mine was a Navy chaplain and was inside the Vatican. He said all the doors and elevators leading down to the catacombs were heavily guarded by armed men in black, para-military style uniforms. Now what could they have down there that such extreme measures are needed to protect? Look on the internet for Ex-Jesuit priest Alberto Rivera and keep digging for info on him. His story about such things is fascinating. So fascinating in fact that the Vatican had him assassinated. Sad but true.

Answer 4

yes, they gathered all that info (because they had no cameras) people DID write these things down
and today that book is called,..."the Bible"

many people seen these things, but it's not all in the bible. some was not selected for the bible so that it wouldn't be too long, or repeat itself too many times.
the new testament is like that, that is the way the did it back then. They had to write it down, which they DID, and now it's called "the Bible"

If Jesus did not exist, why then does the whole world(damn near) know about him?

If Jesus did not exist, why do people use his name in vain? why not "tooth fairy" or "Santa" when cursing?

Answer 5

There isn't. And all of the usual sources people always site (Josephus, Tacitus, etc.) either came out years after the Gospels were already around or are otherwise inapplicable:
http://mama.indstate.edu/users/nizrael/jesusrefutation.html

The link also shows the fallacy in arguments like "Well isn't that like saying Julius Caesar or Christopher Columbus didn't exist", etc.

The writings of Josephus has to be the most ridiculous claim. No Jewish scholar is going to stick a paragraph in the middle of their writings that basically says "Oh yeah, there was also this Jesus fellow at the time. He probably was the messiah. But anyway, as I was saying..."

Though I don't see why this should be a problem to those who have a strong faith in the religion. Personal revelation should be valid enough "evidence" for them.

Answer 6

The earliest reference to Jesus is by the historian Josephus, who mentions "followers of a man named Jesus". Josephus was born after the death of Jesus.

Answer 7

There are records. There are letters from Pilate to Caesar giving reason for crucifying what appeared to be an innocent man for political reasons and not with due process under Roman law as detailed in the Archko Volumes, "Pilate's Report to Caesar" pgs 144 -147, however, some would debate their validity.
Note that most records are locked away in the Vatican library vaults, so it is impossible to retrieve it without the blessing of those in charge over them.

The Roman historian, Tacitus who wrote 'Annals' in 115 CE detailed the following...
* Christ was executed while Tiberius was Emperor (14-37 CE).
* He was executed by order of Pontius Pilate (procurator from 26-36 CE).
* His movement had its origins in Judea.
* There were Christian believers at Rome by CE 64 to be made scapegoats by the Emperor Nero.

BTW, many scoffed at Christians because the Gospels spoke of a tetriarch named Pilate when there were no Roman records of him as well. The scoffing stopped in its tracks when they discovered this stone in Caesaria Meritima.
http://www.holylandvirtualtour.com/quiz/08.jpg
The stone not only identifies Pilate, but ruler of Judea as well.

[DIS AUGUSTI]S TIBERIEUM
[PO]NTIUS PILATUS
[PRAEF]ECTUS IUDA[EA]E
[FECIT D]E[DICAVIT]

Tiberium [of the Caesareans?]
Pontius Pilate,
Prefect of Judea
[. . . had dedicated . . .]
___________________________

Reporting on Emperor Nero's decision to blame the Christians for the fire that had destroyed Rome in A.D. 64, the Roman historian Tacitus wrote:
Nero fastened the guilt . . . on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of . . . Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome...

So there are records. Most are locked aways, others give some detail. However, the real proof is asking Jesus into your heart as Lord and Savior. At that point, it all becomes clear. He was alive? Yes. He was sacrificed for us? Yes. He rose again on the third day? Yes. Alive today? Definitely.

Answer 8

Hmm? Jesus didn't exist but Caiaphas and Pilate did. I guess these two men were insane and hallucinated Jesus and his trial.

Answer 9

Just the historian Josephus. However, all that he says is that he HEARD of Christians believing in a Jesus. He wrote more than forty years after Jesus' death. So, there really is no other primary sources to verify Jesus' existence.

Answer 10

Look up Tacitus,Seutonius,Josephus,Pliny the Younger, the Talmud, Lucian,and Phlegon to start with. Storm Check the references I gave you would not find one that would be considered a "follower" especially the Talmud. Before you criticize and discount check things out.

Answer 11

What are you talking about? What exists, outside of any books or manuals that tell of the story of Christopher Columbus? How do we know he ever really existed?

Ever notice that the Bible is the oldest history written? What are we to do about that today?