Do you think it is important to have in depth genetic tests done on your dogs before breeding them?

Question

Do you think that if the breed or breeds (if mixing) have a predisposition for hip dysplasia that they should be x-rayed? Or do you think it is OK to breed if your dog doesn't show any signs of it?

Do you think that you should run tests to verify that your animal does not carry and genetic defects? Or not?

Why or why not?

My mistake in wording "makeup2more"! I meant in depth testing to make sure that there aren't any genetic issues. Sorry!

;-)

Dogjudge, I was trying to be "politically correct" ....which is rare for me. There are a lot of "designer hybrid" (gag!) breeders that I thought should see this question and the answers.

Answer 1

My dog Logan is an AKC champion.
He has OFA hips - excellent
He has OFA elbows - normal
He has OFA patella normal
He has CERF and gonioscopy normal

He sired 1 litter (16 months ago) - pups turned out very nice. Based on his pedigree, his accomplishments and his health clearances, I'd have no problem studding him out again. However, I may NEVER stud him out again. Even with all that, it's still a coin flip. He's still fairly young, and I'm not yet fully convinced that I will want to use him again.

While all the health clearances are important (for breeding purposes), they really don't guarantee anything. I think it would help to see the health clearances of several generations in a dog's line, and perhaps their siblings, but that's not very do-able (or practical) for most breeders. Even then, a 50-50 chance would only turn into a 65-35 chance at producing nice puppies.

From a puppy person's perspective however, I think I'd like to know that the breeder made some attempt to pair two quality dogs together before I put down a deposit. There was a time when I might have taken the health clearances to imply some sort of guarantee on the puppies, but I now I know better.

ADDED: I wouldn't mind seeing health clearances on my dogs' get. I think it might help me better gague the quality pup that I'm producing. However, I believe asking pet people to do health clearances on spayed/neutered dogs is unreasonable.

Answer 2

Well I think this depends if you want to be a resposnible breeder or not. I myself did all the tests at the right age (2yrs) for hip dysplasia (OFA), elbows, heart eye, thyroid. This was to make sure none of my Golden carried any genitic defects in the line so I could know if the dogs were even of breeding quality.
Breeding other wise is just for profit and no good breeder will do that, it's not their main goal to make money.

The signs of problems can be seen sometimes at an early age but mostly they come with age and by then it's too late to run any tests. Why take a chance of passing down to litter after litter Hip problems if you knew before breeding that the dogs or dog was worthy to be bred in the first place. I've seen first hand what can happen to Golden's who were never screened and bred. The pups have all kinds of joint issues before they even reach 6 months of age. It's heart breaking.

Answer 3

I must agree with Bassetnut, there are many GENETIC tests that are now done. Newfies have a DNA test to determine affected,carrier, or clean for cystinuria.
I think anything that you can do to ensure you are giving the best shot to the puppies and owners should be done.
BYB and puppymillers don't because they are expensive at times and can eliminate a dog from the breeding program. What would they do if they were spending more than they were making?? What would they do if their "breeding stock" all had to be spayed and neutered????
Most irresponsible breeders think it is better to not even go down that road. If you don't know, you don't have to do anything about it!

And you can see from the responses that people are clueless about what testing means. Just because they have a pup from OFA cleared parents, it does not guarantee HD free puppies. It is not that simple. They seem to thing that if the parents were not "inbred" their puppy would not have CHD.

Answer 4

Yes, it is imperative. Studies by the OFA have shown that there is a decrease in the rates and severity of hip dysplasia among breeds that are using hip ratings as a determination for breeding. This, of course, is only effective for the breeds/bloodlines/dogs that are taking part in trying to decrease the incidence.

In several (most?) breeds you can now screen a dog to determine whether it is genetically clear of PRA (Progressive Retinal Atrophy) ... which is crucial since PRA often does't show up until after a dog has already bred. FYI for those not realizing there are now genetic tests: http://www.upei.ca/cidd/Diseases/ocular%20disorders/Progressive%20Retinal%20Atrophy.htm We've been testing Samoyeds for several years now.

We all want healthy dogs who live long and comfortable lives. *I* screen because I want to do my very best to make certain I will not produce dogs with issues- this is for the best for the breed and the owners.... I also screen because its the right thing to do... and frankly, because I'm cheap and don't want to have to refund $$$ because I produced a defective dog. More testing = less money refunded. :o)

Answer 5

It's not just important, it's imparative to do genetic testing on any dog you consider for breeding material. And not just for dysplasia. You should test for whatever is prevalent in your breed (heart, kidneys, hearing, sight, etc.). Many genetic defects will not "show" or manifest themselves in your dog; but he/she could still PRODUCE those defects in the offspring.

On this subject, genetic testing does not solve the problem. It is a TOOL for breeders who want to produce healthy puppies.
It does not quarantee genetically sound offspring, but it does give breeders something to work with that we didn't have twenty or thirty years ago; when selecting a breeding pair was basically done by trial and error.

My pet peeve on this subject is the breeder who does the testing and then IGNORES the results!!!

"Oh, my little Jimmy is just a tiny bit dysplastic or just a little off on the dopplar; no one is going to know so I'll use him at stud anyway."

Until people start being honest with themselves (as well as other breeders looking to use their stud dog); what's the point?

Answer 6

Yes, yes ,no... You should always do the relevant genetic testing for your breed if you are planning on breeding your dog. Along with a reason for breeding it. Like good confimation, temperment etc..... I think breeding MUTTS is wrong anyway and pointless. Anybody that says something mixed with poodle is hypoallergenic is a moron... it's simply not true. We have plenty of wonderful mutts in the shelters and half of those "designer" mixed dogs end up there anyway.

Yes I think you should test to see if your dog carries genetic defects. You wouldnt want to invest your time, money and love in an animal to have it die of DCM (common in my breed) at the age of four with no warning. I know a couple that had to put their beloved GSD to sleep because he had hip dysplasia (as bad as it gets) they had one hip fixed for $5000 and it put them in serious debt and then his other hip blew out and he was in so much pain they had to put their $2000 dog to sleep that they had owned and loved for 3 years. What a waste of time money and heartache that could have been prevented by doing simple xrays..... I believe every breeder should make this effort and if you dont your just in it for the quick buck and shouldnt have anything to do with dogs.

Answer 7

I think all dogs should be OFA'd for hips, elbows, eye, cardiac and any other problems in that breed b4 being bred. Also in many states their is a Puppy Lemon Law and pups bred from unchecked for that breeds genetic defects parents that develop a problem can sue. Well the dog's owners can anyway. A GSD BYB was put out of business using the Law, she bred pups with bad hips and worse temperaments. Several pup owners sued, won thousands and she lost her home and moved. Her "stud" dog was put down he not only had bad hips but was VERY nasty but the females were spayed and rehomed. My Dobe's BIS Int. CH sire was OFA'd for everything Dobes can have plus DNA checked he does not have the bleeding disorder, Von Wilderbrands. His dam was OFA'd for hips and elbows plus tested for VWd so my dog stands an excellent chance of a long healthy life. It is worth the puppy price to have peace of mind.

Answer 8

Yes it is important. Why spend the money, time and energy if you aren't going to do everything in your power to produce healthy puppies??? There is enough 'junk' out there freely supplied to the public by puppy mills and BYB, so if you really care, don't be one of them.

Some genetic defects can actually doom a puppy to a lifetime of pain or become disabling. Would anyone with a conscience want to inflict that on puppies that the deliberately planned and produced???? I know I wouldn't.

I have never...NEVER, made money on a litter. If you do all that you can and should do to insure a healthy litter of pups and take excellent care of Mom too, then you are lucky to even break even. Would I like to make money to help defray my expenses? You bet I would but if I continue to do it the right way, I don't expect to make money and I get my satisfaction just knowing I have produced an asset to the breed with my planned litters and the 'pet' pups will all be spayed/neutered so they do not add to the over pet population that already exists.

Answer 9

If a problem is prevalent in your breed (or line) then it should be tested for if possible. Then you can make an informed decision as to whether that dog should be bred and how.

EDIT: There *are* some genetic tests, for example we now have a DNA blood test for Basset Hound Thrombopathia which will establish whether is dog is clear, affected or carrier.

Answer 10

If your breed has history of hip issues they should be OFA or Penn HIp rated before breeding.
I have a weimaraner who had parents that were "fine" and he is displaysic. He also is blind from Progressive retnial atrophy.
I saw both parents of this dog and both were ok but a CERF certification on the eyes and an OFA on the hips would have saved me much heartache with this dog.
He is awonderful dog but his hunting career was cut short by his problems.