would you?

Question

i keep hearing about how jesus and god love us so much and that they want to save every one of us from eternal damnation, hell. so my question is this. let's say someone is hanging on a rope above a lake of fire. and the only person that can save them is you. you can either reach your hand out and save him or her, or you could let them die. the choice is completely yours. would you really care what that person thought of you before you reached out to help them? would you ask that person if they accepted you as their lord and personal savior? would your decision to help that person rely solely on what he or she says?

and so every moron knows, i've hear the "you know che guevara was a killer?" question a hundred times already. it's not a response to my question. so don't bother answering if that's all you're going to say. btw, it's a picture of me, not che, so get over it... and just answer the question.

whatever you say scneiderman, nice dodging of the question...

so if that person doesn't accept christ you'd let them fall... that's hardly "christ-like", or is it?

Answer 1

It’s a point that, judging by how many people are trying to dance around the issue, Christians are reluctant to answer. Probably the reason most people of faith are so reticent about answering this question, in a straight forward manner, is because you have cut to the heart of what is so depraved and immoral about the Christian scheme of salvation.

A God of omnipotence is by definition not limited by any constraint whatsoever, except the constraint of not being able to do something that is logically self-contradictory. Hence, his ability to save an individual’s soul does not have to be contingent on the said individual accepting any proposition. Furthermore, if he is a creature of infinite love, then he would use his omnipotence to grant salvation to all those he loves, regardless of their beliefs.

That leaves the ardent Christian believer with two scenarios, both of which to the Christian are not very comforting:

1. Either God is not all powerful, and therefore is limited in his ability to save others. This also means that he is probably limited in other ways, and therefore may not be worthy of worship.

Or

2. God is all powerful, but is fundamentally evil, and refuses to save others, because he believes that the charade of believing in something, that from a rational perspective is hard to believe, is worth more than the value of the soul in question.


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Just as an aside to scheidemann2007, the whole issue of Che being a killer, and a ruthless one at that, might be true, but that doesn’t mean that someone who uses his visage, such as myself, is promoting or advocating such heinous actions. Che, after all, was more than an executioner. He was a revolutionary, and individual who sincerely wanted to do the best for the downtrodden, even though his means might have been morally questionable. It is his iconoclastic spirit that I seek to invoke when I use his visage, not his murderous means. I am sure the same holds for anyone, on this forum that uses his face to represent themselves.

Answer 2

Lets turn your question around just for fun. The person is hanging from the rope above the fire about to fall. Jesus reaches out his hand says accept my salvation. Take my hand and I will be your Lord and Savior. Would you take his hand?

Answer 3

Because in your example, you're not speaking of a decision that effects the choices of an individual. The person on the rope above fire or a pit is facing temporal, physical harm. Yes, they would want someone to save them. In the instance of Christ, it is a matter of our decision to live a certain way. Christ does not decide that for us but rather gives us the means to do it.

We are free beings with a free will to make decisions and choices, albeit that freedom was damaged as a result of the fall into sin by Adam and Eve (our wills are hence, in the words of the Council of Trent, downward bent). Eternal life is an option, a choice. It is something to attain. Yes if we do not attain it we will suffer hell, eternal damnation, horrible suffering for all eternity but still God has created us with a free will and he does not force us. In the words of St. Augustine: God created us without us but He will not save us without us. Christ extends His strong arm of safety, of salvation, but He respects the freedom He gave us enough to allow us to choose the path. Then the salvation becomes truly our choice while at the same time a gift of God.

If God where to save us all in Christ indiscriminately then that would not respect the fundamental nature He gave us when He created us. He gave us the ability to reason and to will. We choose and we think. While everyone who is ultimately saved is saved by grace, by God's choice, yet their own freedom plays a role. In the words of the Psalmist: choose this day who you will serve. God created us in a certain way and uses that when He saves us.

He gave us everything we need for salvation in His only Son, Jesus Christ. While He won't force us, He extends mercy and life to us.

Answer 4

You are given many opportunities to accept Jesus before you are dangled over fire. God is the ultimate judge that knows every thing that you have ever done. He only asks one thing, that you do not reject Jesus. Don't worry my friend, you will be given many opportunities to deny Jesus the Christ or accept Jesus. When we tell you God loves you believe it. He is a merciful God that doesn't want any to be lost. But if you continually reject His Son Jesus Christ then God will send you to a Lake of Fire. God is loving, but He is not easy.

Answer 5

How can I answer this but say "Yes". Acceptance of Christ would be necessary to save that person from falling off of the rope.

Answer 6

You are that person dangling on the rope, we all are. Jesus saved us a long time ago, and gave us the way to get off the rope and onto safe ground. He already has given his life to save your/mine. Your the dump one looking up at him saying no thanks I don't want to be saved, i'd rather fall into the firey lake. His hand hand is there and has been all you have to do is take it.

Answer 7

Obviously you don't understand the seriousness of sin. You also don't know my God. He is just and must punish sin. Also those who reject God would be in hell anyway if they went to heaven. People think heaven is a nice cool place to stay out of hell. A place where they are happy and nothing bad happens. True but they leave out the most important reason one wants to go to heaven - GOD!! WE want to be with JESUS, we want to be in his presence, we want to worship and adore him, and we want to live with him forever!!! Those who reject God do not want God. They want to be their own god and worship money, sex, drugs, self, etc....
God is not cruel, he extends his love to all. But if they choose to reject that, they will end up in hell. A place where all sinners will be, God cannot allow sin into heaven. There is no sin in his presence. I am not God. I would do alot of things wrong if I was. I would have already tossed many, many people into hell for killing, raping, torturing kids and people. But God is patient and forgiving. We don't know who will end up getting saved and who will not. I am sinful. Even though I am His child, I am not in heaven yet so I am tainted with sin in my flesh. I do not question God, I know he is good and what he does is for my benefit. Even letting people be cast into hell. The bible says they have no excuse. When you stand before God, make sure he is your savior and not your judge. The bible also says when sinners stand before God they will have nothing to say. They will be mute because they know they sinned and did wrong. What can you say to a holy God when you are guilty? Nothing!

Answer 8

Yes. and why? Because you can't save a person who doesn't want to be saved...or help a person that doesn't want to be helped. If you never cry out to the ONLY one who can save you....are they supposed to think you want to be saved?

But all who CALL upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
(Rom. 10:13)

Answer 9

I would stretch out my hand. I could care less who their personal savior is. I have too much love and compassion for my fellow man to allow my ego or spiritual ideology to get in the way.

Answer 10

Which is exactly why Jesus already went to the Cross and died for our sins, all of us, even those who don't care one way or another whether Jesus died for us or not.