Should there be sanctions against unsubstantiated religious claims?

Question

Visiting an historic church on holiday recently, I noticed a copy of "The Purpose Driven Life" by Rick Warren - a book that I've seen mentioned in various places recently. So, I picked it up and leafed through it. Frankly, I was amazed. I don't know quite what I was expecting but it seemed to be just page after page of "God is this" and "God is that" and "God wants you to do this" and "Your purpose in life is such-and-such"... In other words, a whole book devoted to utterly unsubstantiated claims, presented as cast-iron undeniable facts. Can people get away with this? If I wrote an advertising article with completely unsupported claims about Product X, I would rightly be in hot water. Is it acceptable for religious claims to be entirely exempt from this kind of safeguard?

Rev: Nice try, but of course that is the logical fallacy of begging the question. If there is no such thing as a god or a spiritual realm then there is no such thing as 'spiritual discernment' either.

Answer 1

No sanctions. People have to learn discernment, seek the truth, do the homework, do the library visits and the hours of online searching.... Get educated.

Answer 2

Ah, Icarus, you're just laying bait with this question. :)

In the U.S., the First Amendment protects all manner of religious hogwash.

Consumer protection laws just don't apply.

I think a better answer to the Rev who damned you for lacking "spiritual discernment" is to point out that, according to the verse he quoted, whether someone gets "saved" as a Christian or not doesn't depend on their goodness, their works, their intelligence, or their willingness to believe -- because their //capacity// to believe is set by their deity and is out of their own control, not affected by their virtue or lack thereof.

According to what he quoted from First Corinthians, salvation depends solely on whether their deity decided "I will make this person lucky enough to 'discern' me, and I will make those other people unlucky." So whoever gets saved is a matter of luck; whether some divine being sprinkled the fairy dust of discernment on you, or on somebody else.

Even playing on his own field with his own rulebook, the Rev loses this argument. Of course, neither you nor I has the duty to play on his field with his rules, but sometimes it's so easy I don't resist.

Answer 3

Other than ridicule, no, unless those claims cause demonstrable harm in which case tort law should apply.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tort

Religions could argue that they are not commercial products (although some of us might disagree).

The problem is that the law has traditionally protected religious claims from the ridicule they might otherwise deserve.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy

This seems to be changing now, and a lot of people invested in such claims are getting upset.

Answer 4

You can not make false or unsubstantiated claims about Product X, because someone could actually take Product X and do testing upon it to determine the accuracy of your claims.

People can say what ever they want about God because you can't actually get ahold of God. So there is no way to test the validity of the claims. And as long as God isn't denying anything....well, what can you do?

If I had an imaginary play mate, I could make all sorts of claims about her and no one could tell me I was wrong. I could say she was God and no one could dispute me.

Answer 5

Of course they can...they've been getting away with it since time began, from B.C. to any year A.D. I think you've overlooked the fact that "religion" is a man-made device, a subjective translation of a variety of tenets from the largest best seller of all time, The Bible.

Virtually all of Pastor Rick Warren's writings involve religious beliefs. "The Purpose Driven Life" has been on the best seller list for almost a year and has sold over 11 million copies worldwide!

I cannot think of one organized religion that does not present its beliefs as cast-iron undeniable fact, can you? I should think it an interesting journey to read what Pastor Warren has to say in his 'Purpose Driven' series. There is, after all, from a point of knowledge or even curiousity, something to be said for taking what you need and leaving the rest.

FYI, what follows is the Purpose Driven Covenant given at Angel Stadium on April 17, 2005.

Today I am stepping across the line. I’m tired of waffling and I’m finished with wavering, I’ve made my choice, the verdict is in, and my decision is irrevocable. I’m going God’s way. There’s no turning back now!

I will live the rest of my life serving God’s purposes with God’s people on God’s planet for God’s glory. I will use my life to celebrate his presence, cultivate his character, participate in his family, demonstrate his love, and communicate his word.

Since my past has been forgiven, and I have a purpose for living, and a home awaiting in heaven, I refuse to waste any more time or energy on shallow living, petty thinking, trivial talking, thoughtless doing, useless regretting, hurtful resenting, or faithless worrying. Instead I will magnify God, grow to maturity, serve in ministry, and fulfill my mission in the membership of his family.

Because this life is preparation for the next, I will value worship over wealth, “we” over “me”, character over comfort, service over status, and people over possessions, position, and pleasures. I know what matters most and I’ll give it all I’ve got. I’ll do the best I can with what I have for Jesus Christ today.

I won’t be captivated by culture, manipulated by critics, motivated by praise, frustrated by problems, debilitated by temptation, or intimidated by the devil. I’ll keep running my race with my eyes on the goal, not the sidelines or those running by me. When times get tough, and I get tired, I won’t back up, back off, back down, back out or backslide. I’ll just keep moving forward by God’s grace. I’m Spirit-led, purpose-driven and mission-focused so I cannot be bought, I will not be compromised, and I shall not quit until I finish the race.

I’m a trophy of God’s amazing grace so I will be gracious to everyone, grateful for everyday, and generous with everything that God entrusts to me.

To my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, I say: However, Whenever, Wherever, and Whatever you ask me to do, my answer in advance is yes! Wherever you lead and whatever the cost, I’m ready. Anytime. Anywhere. Anyway. Whatever it takes Lord; Whatever it takes! I want to be used by you in such a way, that on that final day I’ll hear you say, “Well done, thou good and faithful one. Come on in, and let the eternal party begin!”

Can you tell me, after reading this, what safeguards you would like to have in place?

Answer 6

First you'd have to "prove" that they are unsubstantiated claims... can you do that?
Then, we'd have a field day on such topics as evolution, the "Big Bang" theory, Global warming, etc, etc, etc.
So why all the fuss over some Christian book?
Why Christian anything... is it all of a sudden the "IN" thing to do?

Answer 7

Icarus....unfortunately, since God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit and the Bible are considered "spiritual mysteries", it is open season for anyone to write whatever they like.

Peace be with you :)

**Haven't heard of that book, only making a reply as to whether anyone could write what they want without some sort of safeguard. :)

Answer 8

For Christians, the Bible IS undeniable fact. Just because you choose not to believe, doesn't make it untrue. And this is a free country. Everyone has a right to believe (or not believe) in whatever they want. We also have the freedom of religion.

Answer 9

I've heard of it but that's all. What I don't understand is these preachers that say god has talked to them and given them "visions", then charge an exorbitant price for the clap trap, after all, I'm sure the invisible god didn't charge them for the down load.

Answer 10

Nice thought but who would do it?

The writing of books is about control and money. Guess that is why Jesus never wrote a book and published nothing. It is reported he did write in the dust but it is never stated what he wrote.

I do wonder why all these people who say they are following the leadership of Jesus insist on doing what he did not do and writing books? Yes, they may say that Jesus told them to write a Book and I will accept that. So I just let them write and I look for inconsistencies in the writings before I throw the book away.

My approach is let others live their lives and pay the price for it and I will live mine and I will pay the price for my living. So simple and so peaceful.