Atheists, you don't believe in souls....?

Question

Consciousness arises from brain activity yet there have been a lot of instances where people have said to be extremely aware of what's going on around them (even more so than normal) when they aren't supposed to have any brain function ( i.e. medically induced coma or any other operation).
Near death experiences or out-of-body experiences have all been documented and sometimes valided by scientists ( I know yall loooove your scientists).
Now, without brain activity, what would be left if not our souls?

My question stems from reading this article, which I thought was a valid debate.
But since you guys are too busy insulting me and my mental capacities, I guess we won't be having a constructive debate after all.
Have you ever thought that being condescending and using cheap ad hominem arguments can't possibly make you sound smart and actually confirms our belief that most of you are just big blowhards ( like Bill O Reilley, whose intelligence really...eh, u get the point)

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/06/28/tech/main298885.shtml

My tirade is directed towards people such as Reversedevolution, Sipswithafist, Bad M (or something similar)...but of course, the thumbs up that they got make me think that a lot of you agree with their views anyway....

Answer 1

The mind is more than just a sensory filing system. And it involves not only the brain but the entire nervous system. We don't know perfectly how memory or awareness works, or even how to identify or measure every single brain function.

We do know that consciousness seeks to fill in gaps, whether it's the "blind spot" where the optic nerve meets the retina or the interpretation of brain activity during sleep as "dreams". Some people awaking from comas recall nothing, others recall hallucinations. Those who recall the presence and words of visitors may be filling in gaps with predictably familiar actions extrapolated from moments of minimal consciousness during the process. And both parties have a vested emotional interest in believing the "memories" are accurate, so they are seldom questioned.

The fact remains, whatever functional level it may really be at, there is always an organic brain involved in all these "experiences". Scientists and philosophers have tried, and failed, to find the connection point between the organic brain and the metaphysical mind. There is no gland, no locus, no single point of consciousness, awareness, ego. People with brain injuries often reveal amazing facts about how the brain works, how different areas interpret sensory input and stored memory, and how the brain can compensate for impared function. But changes to the memory portions of the brain do affect the "mind". If the "soul" is the true custodian of the mind, that should not happen.

Answer 2

Who says that they do not have any brain function?

They may have no measurable brain function. There is a big difference.

From Earth we can not measure the surface terrain of Venus. That does not mean that there is none.

EEGs are a very crude tool and measure overall activity. They are not capable of fine measurements. A flat EEG does not mean that the person is dead, just that the EEG machine can not pick up any electrical activity.


Edit:
Also most NDEs do not have an EEG recording their brain activity. So for most NDEs you can not say how active or inactive their brain was.

However, NDE like experiences are percieved by people undergoing hypoxia. Which would suggest that NDEs are nothing more than a lack of oxygen to the brain - such as will happen when the heart stops circulating the blood.

Answer 3

Did you know that your dreams even long-seeming ones are mostly sub-second in duration? Near death experiences can occur in the same time period as brain functions are ramped up/restored. I hate to use the term, but near death experiences almost always occur when the person is "mostly dead" and not completely dead.

Medically induced comas or operations do not stop all or even most brain activity, so this has little bearing on proving a soul.

I'd love to see your references for scientist validating near death experiences, and a explanation of what was validated would be useful (i.e. was it validated that the person thought they experienced something or did they validate that the experience was real?)

Answer 4

Atheists don't have self assurance in religious souls. They do have self assurance in nominal souls. A nominal soul is basically existence as all of us comprehend it. religious souls are of supernatural beginning place and has been the midsection of discussion between the Believers and the nonbelievers. religious souls are creations of truly the. There are 2 important descriptions of a spiritual soul. the classic view of the soul is that that's comparable to the spirit on my own. The Biblical view defines it by using fact the union of the spirit and the actual physique. in basic terms human beings have the two spirit and physique, for this reason we are religious souls. A physique with no spirit isn't a soul and for this reason lifeless. A spirit with no physique continues to be no longer a soul and can't connect with the actual international. what's spirit? The spirit is the nonphysical element of our physique. It is composed of our innovations, will, and existence stress. The spirit interacts with the actual international in the process the innovations. for this reason that's puzzled as innovations in early philosophies. i'm hoping this helps a puzzled soul. Godspeed!

Answer 5

Everyone has a subconscious. There is so much about the human brain that we are unaware of, I find it hard to believe these claims.

I once had a dream where my sister died. When I woke up my pillow was wet from me crying. It was real in my mind. That doesn't mean it really happened.

I am open to the possibility I am wrong though. Also, why do people assume atheists love scientists? Most atheists I know question research as well. It is about using your mind and thinking for yourself. Not believing everything in a book, even if it is a science book.

Answer 6

If I'm going to believe in souls, the argument needs to come from someone in a normal state of consciousness, not when they're near death, hallucinating or dreaming. If your brain activity totally ceased, you wouldn't be near death, you would be dead. The brain not only allows us to think, it is also the control center for our basic bodily functions, like breathing and blood circulation. And the common aspects of near death experience, such as seeing bright light and dead relatives, can be explained as resulting from the activity that takes place in the brain at the time. I think that people who attach supernatural significance to these types of events are just looking for confirmation for they want to believe.

Answer 7

Hi there.

1) atheists can believe in souls (just not necessarily the same definition that Christians use)

2) People in comas etc DO have brain functions, just not consciousness

3) Scientest have validated near-death experiences, yes, but they have ALSO identified the natural, scientifically supported explanations for those experiences.

Answer 8

Out of body experiences fall under the same line of phenomenon that false alien abduction memories fall into.

You see someone doped up on sedatives and other medicines in a hospital bed and put under a bright light, and you wonder where these things come from?

There is no scientific evidence supporting this sort of thing. Nor is there any evidence for the 'soul', scientifically or logically.

Answer 9

atheist = dont believe in god.
yes , true . souls . so ? have you read the scientific
explaination of NDE?

do you also know that MOST ( actually ALL those i randomly picked to read ) of the NDE account i read , have no mentioning of any religious characters?

of these NDE accounts experience by this people , they stop being as religious and instead becoming more spiritually.

if souls = who you are , enable you to be aware and think like normal . wanna try having a stroke that affect your WHOLE brain and still be able to have proper memory , talk/ think properly ?

Answer 10

I refuse to answer anybody who makes the statement "I know yall loooove your scientists."

Eh, what the hell, I'll condescend.

Of course, there's really nothing to answer. You've provided no specific examples at all, and your language is extremely imprecise. Give me a case in which a patient with zero brain activity has experienced some form of "consciousness." I doubt you can!