Question about the theif on the cross?

Question

so he said remember me when you come into your kingdom, and jesus said today you will be with me in paradise.

yet we read that jesus spent the next 3 (earth days) in some place talking and ministering to the dead, so was this place paradise (or Purgatory) where the theif was.

i can find a ton of other verses like, putifying fire, refiners fire etc.

an ideas

JWs love to change the comma to explain their beliefs. The bible may have been written in greek (not hebrew) yet jesus spoke in aramaic, they dont have commas

Answer 1

im not sure .. time and space are relative to us here from the physical plane ... He may have gone to several places and where He was may have been much "longer" than we perceive here ...

Answer 2

When Jesus said today I tell you . He ment that he was talking to him that day and was making him a promise on that day that he would be with him in paradise.

The paradise he was talking about is the paradise on earth. That's what the Good News that Jesus was preaching was all about.

As his modle prayer brings out, " Let your kingdom come let your will be done ON THE EARTH just as it s in heaven.

Jesus spent 3 days in the grave and then was raised back to life on the earth.

There were ieght resurections recorded in the Bible. You will note that all of the people that were resurected, they were resurected back to life here on the earth. If they went some where else after death don't you think that at least one of them would have said something. They all thank him with joy.

What Jesus was showing all the people of that day was a small scale of what was to come in the future. That is a resurection of all mankind during the thousand year riegn after the great tribulation is over.

All the fire, purgatory, sufferring, burning and so on is a false teaching by the churches to scare people into not leaving the church.

The mis-translation and teaching of the word hell started aroung 1610 when the King James version was translated.

Hell came from the Greek word Hade's.
Hade's defined as hole or pit with no rendering what so ever of fire or torment.

Hade's was then translated from the Hebrew word Sheo'l which means grave, hole, pit, or the place mankind goes after he dies, which also has no rendering of fire, torment,
pugatory or suffering.

If you go to your Bible and turn to Ecclesiastes 9:5,6 it will tell you the condition of the dead.
You can find all this information in the liturature below.
Hope I have been of some help and if you
want more information I would be glad to send you some.

Sincerely yours,
Fred M. Hunter
[e-mail]

Answer 3

The common mistranslation from the Greek language. The passage should read:

Truly I say to you today, you will be with me in paradise.

Notice the comma after the word "today"

This is how the passage should have been translated.

Answer to Comment: Sorry to disappoint you, but I am not a JW. This is a true fact. You must do some research on your own.

If you are Catholic or from any Christian denomination, then the word "paradise" is in conflict with your belief since you are going to Heaven. Paradise is a physical place on Earth.

Answer 4

I believe that Jesus was saying that the thief would be in Heaven that day. As God and Jesus are One, then by joining God in Heaven that day, the thief was joining Christ there, even though Christ did not actually ascend to the Father (God) until the 3rd day, in order to fulfill prophecy. I believe that when Jesus was crucified and put in tight, swaddled burial clothes and placed in a tomb with a humongous boulder sealing off the entrance for 3 days, that was the amount of time that people of that day would have known that His body should have been smelling pretty bad, due to the body's decaying process. Had He descended to Heaven that very day, the miracle of His resurrection would not have been so pronounced, because people would have just thought He was not truly dead. After such a crucifixion when there was no pulse, there could be no doubt of a person being dead when they lied in the tomb, wrapped so tightly that it would have been impossible to move, and without food, water or medical treatment of any kind.

The 3 days in the tomb was necessary to prove to the people of that day that He did indeed die. THEN, when He appeared, in full body form - not mere Spirit, and the boulder had been rolled away and the burial clothes retained their shape as if He had just vaporized, the miracle of His resurrection was quite evident, as seen by many witnesses. It was after He saw His disciples, that He finally descended to Heaven, in full body and Spirit. I believe that by telling the thief he would join Him in Paradise that day, it was because the thief did indeed join God that day, and since the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are One and the same, then indeed the thief joined GOD in Heaven that day and Christ in human form joined God on the 3rd day.

Now, I have not seen anything in the Bible to explain the exact timeframe that the thief went to Heaven, so what I am saying is purely my opinion only. This is just my guess.

Answer 5

Jesus did not write it. He spoke it. "I say to you, today you ect. He paused. So what are the odds. According to your own statement Aramaic uses no commas. That does not mean that there was no inflection in their speech. It could have been either way and you have no way of proving which so your argument is no better than theirs. That is strictly a matter of language. Fifty Fifty, depending on which side the inflection was on. As for the rest of it I am an atheist and don't believe any of it happened any way.

AEN

Answer 6

It is possible that Christ in death could travel to paradise and back in a moment of time and then go to the other places.

Philip was ministering to an Ethiopian and when he was done he was translated from the desert to a city in a moment of time in his earthly body. I am sure Christ could go where He wanted as quickly as he wanted and take the theif with Him and then go somewhere else in His spiritual form.

Remember when He appeared to His disciples after the resurrection he was in the room with them but the doors were locked. A spiritual body lives on a plane we cannot comprehend in this mortal body.

Answer 7

where'd you read that? I read of Him going to Hell. zechariah 9:9-12. no mention of an in-between realm.

I suggest you do more research on the refining fire. it's more of a refining of the heart that a post-life refining.

paradise, aka Abraham's bossom was like a sub-Heaven, a waiting place for Israel and those who died in hope before Christ died and was resurrected. you'll read about the dead rising when Jesus died.

Answer 8

Ah yes, St. Dismas.
Interesting question. If Jesus is everywhere like they claim then I guess it would not be a problem. But then how do you explain his later talk as being here or there.
It seems that religion requires you to have only two brain cells who must not be on speaking terms.

Answer 9

expensive Holy ghost, sheol and abraham's bossom are a preserving place for those formerly Christ is composed of declare them. See a million Thessalonians while Christ returns- the lifeless in Christ shall upward push first. they are nevertheless going to heaven because of the fact they have depended on in the righteousness of Christ. ephesians 2:8-9 says for with the help of grace we've been saved (no longer with the help of baptism). it particularly is a cutting-edge of God no longer consequently of works. Baptism is a artwork. it particularly is taken under consideration necessary for the believer to be baptized out of obedience to Christ. even in the journey that your undeniable fact that the theif ont he pass grew to become into in Abraham's bossom, in that tale there have been those on the different area who longed to be on the different area (in Abraham's bossom). confident i will no longer be able to understand why somebody saved does not prefer to be baptized- yet baptism isn't a call for for salvation. wish that facilitates, Nickster

Answer 10

That place was neither paradise nor purgatory, Jesus went to hell to take the keys of death from satan. So in other words he gave the people in hell a second chance , like John 3:16

Answer 11

If the thief was to be anywhere else initially, and then go to paradise, jesus would not have said "Today!" The thief received forgivenss and salvation there and then... God is not slow to His promise.

God bless,
Andrew