fate or not?

Question

I think fate is total crap. However when I think about this, it makes my head spin...

Exactly 10000 years from now, the state of the universe will be something. Call it State A. No one knows what State A is, but there will be a State A. So no matter what we do now, the universe will be in State A in 10000 years.

It's not fate, because people can do what they want, when they want, but is like we are all converging to the same point in space-time. Crazy.

Any thoughts?

come on, turn on your noggins. i figured at the very least the agnositcs/atheists would enjoy some philosophy.

i never said state A was bad or scary...

Answer 1

Technically everything that happens is the result of something. Imagine if there were a supercomputer so incredibly powerful that it was capable of mapping out the exact location and velocity of every particle in the universe at a specific time. These particles obey certain physical laws, and if that computer understood these laws it could predict the movement and interaction of those particles with absolute accuracy. Therefore it could predict exactly how it is that your State A will come about. If this computer existed then it would demonstrate that free will is an illusion. Even if you flip a coin to make a decision, this computer would be capable of predicting exactly how you'd hold the coin, the atmospheric conditions, which choice would correspond with which side of the coin, and literally millions of other factors, meaning that it could still predict your decision.
So fate exists in a sense, but only as a meaningless technicality. The millions of minute details that affect everything we do are simply incomprehensible.

Answer 2

Fate is “the will or principle or determining cause by which things in general are believed to come to be”, so for something to be fated is to say that, no matter what actions are taken, the outcome will be the same. Example – if the universe is going to be in State A 100000 years from now, no actions or inaction on the part of any form of life in the universe can stop the universe from being in that State at that time.

If you think that Fate is not correct, you would say that some interaction could change that fate, and the outcome could be different. Of course, no one can know what the original outcome would have been, so it’s difficult to say with certainty that it was changed…

Let’s take an example closer to home. Let’s take the life of a guy – we’ll call him Algernon, or Al for short. Al does drugs, steals from his parents and friends to buy drugs, and narrowly escaped capture for a failed robbery at a local liquor store. You might say that he is fated to end up in jail or dead, and few would argue with you. If, however, you were to talk to him, show him the error of his ways (we’re assuming you’re really, really persuasive, and pretty hot, too), and he actually changes his life, gives up drugs, and becomes a different person, you could say that you intervened in his fate, thereby changing his destiny and the potential future. Now let’s say that he saves the life of the Pope two years later – at a time when he surely would have been incarcerated or dead had you not interfered originally – and the Pope goes on to unite all religions of the world and bring peace to religious turmoil and war – now your action has had a ripple effect of the fate of the world, at least in the short term.

Of course, there are others who would argue that it was YOUR destiny – your fate to save Al’s life and turn him around.

The argument is circular, isn’t it? Whee!!!

Answer 3

You ever played a game of snooker?

You ever watched a professional snooker player in action?

The white ball can be hit in such a way as to smack the next red ball on one side and send it straight into the corner pocket. Sometimes this even involves bouncing off other balls... but it is a very precise process and has very predictable results.

Now imagine atoms.... or even subatomic particles if you like.


... Same deal.
When the white atom smacks the red atom, there is only one way the red atom can go.... dependant on how it was hit.
Multiply this up a few google-fold (an actual number; not just a search engine)..... and you have the Universe.

It might not be possible for humanity to predict the bouncing of every atom in the Universe all the time..... but it follows what is effectively a set pattern, and if we had a computer capable of monitoring all that data then it could actually predict the entire course of time.
Yes.... it is essentially pre-set...

Answer 4

Umm it's like you answered your own question "state A" is our fate it's everyones fate and it cannot be avoided because you said universe. So, no matter where you go no matter what you do you still will find yourself in "state A". Humans (well nothing for that matter) can escape the totality of known or supposed objects and phenomena throughout space which is the universe.

Answer 5

The universe is always moving from one state to the next. That just implies change. You would have to know state A for this to be a concern.

Answer 6

no thoughts, just spinning in confusion.
sorry its been a long day!

are we all moving towards a gigantic super-state > is that your point?

well i suppose my great great great great great great great great great great grandchildren may have something to say about it, but by then my flesh will have returned to the earth and my breath to the air, so thankfully i'll miss it if it happens. quite a scary thought if it did happen. who the heck would run it???

Answer 7

yes, fate is a horrible concept. i don't know why anyone would want it to be real, especially since it contradicts free will.

Answer 8

Hmmm....no idea I guess when we would convert over to state B?

Answer 9

This makes no sense to me.

Answer 10

Puff pufff give puff puff give!