Theists! Stop avoiding this question!?

Question

I want to know: How would you like it if instead of responding to your questions with a logical arguement designed to refute or support your claim we simply asserted that you were being ridiculous and that you needed to have faith? The fact is: you'd hate it, more than we would even, as we've gotten fairly used to it at this stage.

Mr. A, I'd love to hear them, but remember that part of writing history is correcting the mistakes historical characters made.

randyken, I need to go for dinner, but when I manage to get back to this I'll read your answer: so it better be a good one.

Answer 1

Good question, and I think you are right. They would hate it more. Perhaps it might even motivate them to do a little research on logical fallacies. Who knows maybe they'd learn for themselves instead of having to be taught by the very people the despise.

Answer 2

Sometimes logic, reason, science (choose your term) cannot define the answer. Sometimes the answer is an experience and if one party has had the experience while another hasn't, then both of you cannot discuss the experience.

It is easier to discuss something that both sides are aware of; you can still discuss something that one knows about and the other wants to learn; but it is very difficult to discuss something that one person knows about and the other says, "I've never experienced it, so you can't have experienced either".

I watched Carl Sagan's movie, "Contact" last night with Jodie Foster. It was the first time I've seen it and watching the interaction between Jodie Foster's character, a scientist that doesn't believe in God, and a theist really helps to explain what I just expressed. I recommend it and will probably show my kids this weekend. It's a good movie with a subplot to help people understand our differences.

God bless,

Answer 3

Er.

You know, there's a lot of us theists who don't ever say anything like what you're broadly accusing every theist of doing.

As for me, it's early morning here, and I haven't been *avoiding* anything.

But hang on, let me go check.

EDIT: Nope, I've never done so.

But, if you were to address this question to theists who actually DO do what you're talking about, I doubt you'd get very many honest answers.

I don't recommend playing the "faith" card as a tactic, though - there are already enough people who want atheism to be classified as a religion, probably because they think they can tie a "belief" in evolution to it, and thereby get evolutionary theory taken out of public schools as being "religious doctrine"


BTW, I do understand your frustration, but it won't serve you well to lump all theists together.

As for me, if an atheist told me I just "needed to have faith", I'd laugh myself silly...and immediately wonder if the person was someone just posing as an atheist.

Answer 4

well what logical arguments do you use...? Science? The science which has as many holes on it as they claim religion does? I go by the bible because it is the truth; its Gods word and neither you nor anyone else in the past has been able to discredit it or find a contradiction in it. The bible also lets us know to live by faith not by sight so what else do you want me to say? Oh and to answer your question people call christians narrow minded, wrong, crazy, and a lot of other things on here... Just because you don't do it doesn't mean its not being done already. So if you are looking for a pity party for people saying your logical is flawed too then I guess Yahoo is not for you.

God Bless

Answer 5

Answering, and it's a long one. You have asked twice, so dammit, you'd better read it AND CONSIDER it.

A: The only time I would tell someone it's all about faith is when they question why I believe in God. Without walking, not a mile, but walking EVERY mile I've walked in MY shoes, you cannot understand. It is about faith. My experiences lead me to this conclusion.

Further, I have given up on responding with anything logical to angry atheistic posts (and angry Christian posts, too, quite objectively) as they are only posted to get a slap on the butt from others who eat up the sentiment. There are so few original thoughts on here from either side, what's the point in trying to offer one? No one is going to read something contrary, let alone consider it. The two most common examples of this I am familiar with here are the Christians who ask why people don't believe in the Bibble when the Bible says what is written is true and the inspired word of God. WHAT??!! They can't REALLY be serious, can they? Then there's the atheist interogative, if God created the universe, who created God? This Q is only asked about 200 times a day. What measure of arrogance suggests that asking ONE MORE time, the walls of Christianity are going to come crashing down?

You ask why you get no logical answers? Ask a Q. Read my answer. Consider it. Don't belittle any contrary ideas. Respect is earned. Do you want it? Ask away.

edit #2: Some of my Q's (logical, I think)


http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=An01rOnzHxjOHNL3RivhDb7ty6IX?qid=20070712113112AAno2cm

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AshVqr7qzmtVhnJ_ncGRIZLty6IX?qid=20070709120628AAEkYVn

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AvY.UN1GIvY14Z1X2PPm._Tty6IX?qid=20070706133051AAP9ELH


Some of my answers (again, logical, I think)

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AjudTVhdApri7NsZ9hea6Brty6IX?qid=20070713074945AAVIngL&show=7#profile-info-0Gg0dxmGaa

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AqDbBLgdJIHZBZiZbuTBL1jty6IX?qid=20070713074019AAGCmYi&show=7#profile-info-SvsOE5hmaa

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AtBxIS6Qp6ewDZdjVK9Y5xDty6IX?qid=20070713073723AApYccf&show=7#profile-info-t7pCWZ0Jaa

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=Ag73i39DFzE6SllQSBkyIgLty6IX?qid=20070712112951AAnD9he&show=7#profile-info-XnxBrbkyaa


I believe what I believe and leave those to believe whatever works for them, but it becomes so painfully apparent that many do not have an original thought in their head, and this is obvious from members of each camp. It is useless to answer

(Thought I ran out of space)

It is useless to answer a Q that is posted to incite animosity. It is likewise useless to to try and answer a question formed from borrowed thoughts and logic. Any BELIEF that isn't found by the believer themselves is an indication of a weak mind. I have come to believe in God because of my experiences. My beliefs mimic some of catholicism, but they are indeed my own. I believe because I have experienced what I have experienced. Anyone willing to accept that empathy is the only way to understand where someone else is coming from can take another's statements into context. therefore, I say, anyone who doesn't listen to their opposition is without empathy, and I have comeo across this so frequently here, my heart annd mind and soul have become numb trying to explain anything to anyone else.

But you did ask twice.

Answer 6

lol, I had not even seen your first question. And, yeah I don't tell people to just have faith. I am well aware of the fact that I can convince no one to believe in God. . .I can't. . .there is nothing I can say. I have my own personal experiences that cause me to have my beliefs. I tend to just live my life the best I can and let others do the same.

Answer 7

Are you speaking of theists of any kind, anyone who worships or honors any kind of god?

Or are you speaking specifically to those who refer to themselves as "theists" as others refer to themselves as pagans, atheists, agnostic,etc.?

If it's the first...I already get quite a lot of that, and I've become rather resigned to people telling me that if I would only believe as they do, my life would be better and my soul taken care of.

Atheist logic makes sense, as far as it goes, but I am also aware that I have had several experiences which most atheists have not had, which does not factor into their arguments. But as these experiences are almost entirely subjective, they don't mean much to atheists.

I can't refute the evidence of their senses. And they can't refute the evidence of mine. Stalemate. Truce?

Answer 8

When I was in America, I noticed that "In God We Trust" or something like that was printed on all dollar bills!. I am an athiest HIndu, born and raised in India and I wondered, "I may not be the smartest person, Americans are generaly smart they say, so may be there is this God".

I came back and am settled in India now. American people, why did you make me use those dollar bills with such nonsense written on it? If I use it, I accept it right?

Answer 9

The point is that faith isn't about logic. Faith is about Faith without needing Facts, the ability to believe in something without needing to see it, touch it, have visible and certain proof that it exists. So your argument about logic is null to us, and our argument about faith is null to you... yet its going to continue because neither side will see the other in the way that the other sees it.

And you're stereotyping both Christians and Athiests here....

Answer 10

I define "god" as "the natural universe" and not a supernatural being. Kind of hard to deny the natural universe exists as it would make anyone look silly.

Good point though.

To "Mr. A": Jesus wasn't worshipped as a god until the Council of Nicea in 325 A.D. where it was "decided" that he was "divine". If it took a vote to get to that point, it puts Christianity in a whole new light. Plus, archaeology shows that parts of the Bible are correct, and some parts aren't. Your "truth" might not be as accurate as you think it is.