Jehovah's Witnesses , how do you read the following scriptures and still not understand the deity of Christ

Question

and God..Philippians 2: 5-11...Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus: 6. Who, being in the very nature God did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, 7 but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness. 8 And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death even death on a cross. 9. Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name, 10. that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

The above was from the NIV Bible..it reads so simple and beautiful..Below is from your NWT..the same scriptures..It is not written the same way and it is attempting to take away the meaning of these scriptures..Why?

NWT..same scriptures:
5 Keep this mental attitude in YOU that was also in Christ Jesus, 6 who, although he was existing in God’s form, gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God. 7 No, but he emptied himself and took a slave’s form and came to be in the likeness of men. 8 More than that, when he found himself in fashion as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient as far as death, yes, death on a torture stake. 9 For this very reason also God exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every [other] name, 10 so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground, 11 and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.

discipleabct.....I am sorry, but I don't understand what you are saying or asking..Please explain to me further.

Bambi'AbiJah..I totally agree with you..Satan has blinded minds..Maybe its yours that he has blinded?
We can understand the trinity..very plain..God is still the Father in Heaven..Jesus has God in him..the form of a man..The Holy Spirit resides in all who have excepted Christ into their lives..They are 3 different ones..but all the same..Minds and eyes that are not blinded ..that are open..can understand this ..Ones that are blind..cannot. .
Satan makes himself out to be a good angel..he also makes his followers not realize that they are following him. They seems to be angels of light and good wonderful people..but they are blinded by Satan. One would be wise to make sure of all things as the Bible states to do.

Answer 1

Thank you for bringing this to light ABC.......

Praise God for the truth.

Jesus Christ was all the fullness of the Godhead, bodily.

Answer 2

i'm uncertain once you're a witness, yet merely to make sparkling some thing, those guides are written with the familiar public in recommendations and not unavoidably for JW's even nevertheless we appreciate interpreting them. to place God there clarifies to the final guy or woman who's the "he" in the verse. Now as some distance because of the fact the verese in John 14, this is merely clarifying that we mindset Jehovah in the call of christ to tutor our faith in his sacrifice. additionally, my NWT does not go connection with John 14:13. The verse at 1John 5:14 crosses to Proverbs 15:29 & John 9:31 the place it merely tells us that God listens to the prayers of the righteous ones. Ask the witness you meet with to tutor you a kingdom interlinear or an emphatic diaglott. those 2 guides are a literal greek to english be conscious for be conscious translation and could tutor you the right rendering of the unique textual content fabric.

Answer 3

Jesus is a deity. - John 1:1

He is simply not God. God can not be exalted to a superior position since he is already King of the heavens and God to all creation.

Phil 2:9 - For this very reason also God exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every [other] name

Jesus when in heaven is a deity and a spirit creature. In that state he did not fail like the Cherub of Eden and succumb to grasping equality to God as Satan and then the human Eve had done.

Phil 2:5 - "Who, being in the very nature God did not consider equality with God something to be grasped"

Answer 4

Phil. 2:6-7 is rendered differently even in different trinitarian Bibles. The KJV says (speaking of the pre-existent Jesus):
"Who, being [huparchon] in the form [morphe] of God, thought it not robbery [harpagmon] to be equal to God. But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form [morphe] of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men."

But the equally trinitarian GNB [Good News Bible] renders it:

"He always had [huparchon] the nature [morphe] of God, but he did not think that by force [harpagmon] he should try to become equal with God. Instead of this, of his own free will he gave up all he had and took the nature [morphe] of a servant." (Compare the NEB)

And the NIV changes the meaning of harpagmon to "did not consider equality with God something to be grasped [harpagmon]."

The problem here is that morphe did not mean "nature" (or "essence"); huparchon means more than just "existed," "was," etc., and harpagmon does not mean "grasped," "cling to," "hold on to," etc. (RDB)

(For much more on these scriptures, click: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JWquestions_and_answers_archives/message/125)

Answer 5

To Jehovah's Glory.
Not to Jesus' Glory.

I read it; read it twice.
I don't 'see' how you could read it &
come to think Jehovah God was Jesus.

(Except to go to the text that says:
"Satan blinds their minds")

Jesus is a God.
Not the Almighty God YHWH aka Jehovah.

-------" that Jesus Christ is Lord ------
---------'to the glory of God the Father' "--------
To God's glory NOT Jesus' glory.



edit: thx 4 the editorial, I HAVE Researched,
spent many Hours dedicated to searching out the truth,
I wanted the truth, wherever it may take me.
And Jesus & Jehovah Clearly & Concisely more than once
and more than twice, speak to & about each other as seperate individuals.
The idea of a triune godhead came from the Greek
but originated out of Babylon.
I learned this NOT from the Witnessess. Nope!,
I learned it @ the public library. Then the Holy Scriptures.
So I know I am not blinded by Satan, any more.
And anyways, when Jesus returns,
we all will know "the real deal,"
the whole truth & nothing but the truth.
Agree?

Answer 6

Please read what you wrote: (Caps are comments only)

5. Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus

(OUR ATTITUDE SHOULD BE THE SAME AS CHRIST.

IF CHRIST BELIEVE HE WAS EQUAL TO GOD, SO SHOULD WE?)

6. Who, being in the very nature God

(GREEK READS 'FORM OF GOD' NOT NATURE, THIS MEANS JESUS IS A SPIRIT CREATURE JUST AS GOD IS A SPIRIT)


did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,

(THE GREEK WORD TRANSLATED GRASPED, LITERALLY MEANS, ROBBERY, RAPE, OR PLUNDER,

JESUS DID NOT CONSIDER EQUALITY WITH GOD AS SOME TO BE ROBBED, RAPED OR PLUNDER.

EVEN THE WORD GRASPED CAN MEAN TO REACH FOR, 'HE GRASPED FOR THE TREE LIMB'

THUS, JESUS DID NOT CONSIDER EQUALITY WITH GOD AS SOMETHING TO BE REACHED FOR.)


he humbled himself and became obedient to death even death on a cross.

(THE BOOK OF Habakkuk SAYS GOD CAN NOT DIE)

9. Therefore God exalted him to the highest place

(IF CHRIST IS EQUAL TO GOD, HOW CAN HE BE EXALTED TO A THE HIGHEST PLACE, LITERALLY 'PUT UP HIGH OVER, WHO EXAULTED HIM? HIMSELF?)

confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

(WHO IS GLORIFIED BY JESUS' ACTIONS? GOD.

PLEASE NOTE 1 COR 15:. 27 For [God] “subjected all things under his feet.” But when he says that ‘all things have been subjected,’ it is evident that it is with the exception of the one who subjected all things to him. 28 But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone.

PLEASE NOTE THIS ABOUT THE NIV:

*** w79 7/15 p. 27 Insight on the News ***
Why did the recently published “New International Version” (NIV) of the Bible fail to use the name of God where it appears about 7,000 times in ancient Bible manuscripts? In response to a person who inquired about this, Edwin H. Palmer, Th.D., Executive Secretary for the NIV’s committee wrote:

“Here is why we did not: You are right that Jehovah is a distinctive name for God and ideally we should have used it. But we put 2 1/4 million dollars into this translation and a sure way of throwing that down the drain is to translate, for example, Psalm 23 as, ‘Yahweh is my shepherd.’ Immediately, we would have translated for nothing. Nobody would have used it. Oh, maybe you and a handful [of] others. But a Christian has to be also wise and practical. We are the victims of 350 years of the King James tradition. It is far better to get two million to read it—that is how many have bought it to date—and to follow the King James, than to have two thousand buy it and have the correct translation of Yahweh. . . . It was a hard decision, and many of our translators agree with you.”

Concerning the NIV:

Bruce Metzger: "It is surprising that translators who profess to have 'a high view of scripture" should take liberties with text by omitting words or, more often, by adding words that are not in the manuscripts."


.

Answer 7

Among creatures heavenly and earthly, the personal name "Jesus" is above every other. This question seems to refer to Philippians 2:9, which does NOT refer to any personal name but DOES clearly teach that Jesus (the Son) is distinct from and subject to God the Father (the highest name of all, "Jehovah").

(Philippians 2:8,9) [Jesus] became obedient as far as death, yes, death on a torture stake. 9 For this very reason also God exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every other name

So if the name is not a personal name, then what is that "name"? Isaiah 9:6 specifically notes that Jesus Christ's "name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace".

(Isaiah 9:6) For there has been a child born to us, there has been a son given to us; and the princely rule will come to be upon his shoulder. And his name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.


Incidentally, the bible does indicate a handful of times that an angel has been called by the name "Jehovah" to indicate that the angel is specifically functioning as Jehovah's direct representative. Jehovah's Witnesses believe it likely that each of these incidents involves Jesus Christ as that direct representative, although that is not a doctrinal matter which the bible clearly teaches. If that is a correct understanding, it seems likely that Jesus will continue to be used for such purposes in the future (perhaps in an ongoing basis, or exclusively).

(Genesis 18:22) At this point the [materialized angels appearing as] men turned from there and got on their way to Sodom; but as for [the angel using the name of] Jehovah, he was still standing before Abraham

Learn more:
http://watchtower.org/e/ti/index.htm?article=article_05.htm
http://watchtower.org/e/na/index.htm?article=diagram_04.htm
http://watchtower.org/e/20050915/article_01.htm

Answer 8

I just gained a little more respect for the NIV.

Anyway, just as it is wrote, Jesus did not consider equality with God, as something to be grasped.

That's what Satan did.

Phillipians 2:6
"...did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,..."



Joh 20:17 Jesus saith to her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended unto the Father: but go unto my brethren, and say to them, I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and my God and your God.

Joh 14:28 Ye heard how I said to you, I go away, and I come unto you. If ye loved me, ye would have rejoiced, because I go unto the Father: for the Father is greater than I.

Answer 9

and I can add more scripture onto your question:

John 10:30 - when Jesus literally says "I and the Father are one."

and Colossians 2:9 which states: "For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form."


Jesus is God in the flesh.
I'm interested also in their answer.


J.W. people pay attention to verse 6 of the asker's scripture reference "Who, being in the very nature God ..."
(I have read some responses, and yet have to be convinced that J.W. followers have any legitimate reason for dis-believing the Trinity.)

Answer 10

To The asker, why do confess to be a follower of Christ than quote someone other than Christ.