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what was he thinking when he wrote this in 1000BC?

I am looking for scholary explanation as I reject all prophecy

2007-07-26 14:43:22 · 19 answers · asked by sahara_springs 3 in Society & Culture Religion & Spirituality

19 answers

David didn't write the word pierced. In the Hebrew text - the word is 'lion'. In fact later on in the same psalm, lion appears - the exact same word as the one translated as 'pierced'. For some reason it is translated incorrectly in one verse and then correctly in another.

This first mistranslation appeared in the 1611 King James Version. Christians like to look for 'proof texts' in the Old Testament to prove that Jesus is really their savior. Many of these 'proof texts' are mere words or half verses, that can only prove something if you already believe in Jesus.

Other parts of Psalm 22 tend to make Christians think of Jesus being crucified. So they claim that the pslam is a forshadowing of his death for all people. The changing of the word lion to pierce is part of this effort. Although if you read the text, lion makes a lot more sense. Also, the words for lion and pierced in Hebrew are not even close to sharing the same root. There can be no innocent errors here.

Another problem area is in Isaiah - where he speak of a 'virigin' giving birth. This word actually means young woman - the word virgin shares no common root for young woman. And Isaiah is talking about something that is happening in the present, not in the future. You can tell that by the tense and by the name that is chosen for the baby - which is definitely not Jesus.

2007-07-26 15:03:52 · answer #1 · answered by noncrazed 4 · 2 1

Psalms 22:16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.


Since you reject all prophecy, I'm going to assume you've already read the whole of chapter 22 and found the similarities. If not, they're kinda trippy to go through.

Anyways, these verses are very poetic in nature. Metaphors are usually both strong and strange when put in poetic context. Possibilities can flood from anywhere.

These kinds of words come from someone that's in a lot of pain. We've seen it in plenty of movies, and probably in our own lives, where people have something go tragically wrong and start crying to God, either in blame or submission. It seems quite out of context among the chapters. Chapters 22 and 23 both have a feeling of doom. The previous chapters have a pattern of prayer for deliverance, then a praise for deliverance. Then suddenly, David's talking about death.

It could be his imagination, thoughts that might have come over him during battle. In times of battle, a man can imagine the worst thing that could happen to him, like being delivered into the hands of the enemy. Spears were a common weapon used for piercing. Hands and feet are strange things to aim for in battle, so it would be a reference to torture.

As for a scholarly explanation, you'd have to research into the battles that took place between those chapters, and research the events that went on in David's life (because he wrote about his sorrow over his sin with Bathsheba). I'm no biblical genius that I wish I were, but I do have access to many literary and internet sources with information like this, and of all of them that I've read, they all refer to the prophecy of Christ.

As for responses that call the word a mistranslation, that's bull crap. It's put in context and translated the best. You can't take a word and say "well, it's the exact same word as used over here, so it has to mean the same thing." I could use the word "cool" and translated in Spanish, or any other major language, they'd have several words for what I mean. The word for "pierced" is properly translated in its context.

Hope you find your answer.

2007-07-26 22:13:14 · answer #2 · answered by Christian #3412 5 · 1 0

I agree with the second person. The fact of the matter is that it was prophecy of Jesus. What more scholarly info would you like? Its not like anyone else sits there trying to research that specific verse in a scholarly way because the meaning is obvious. And if your just going to reject prophecy then why even look into the scholarly explanation? It is all very biased in my eyes.

2007-07-26 21:56:01 · answer #3 · answered by pony 3 · 0 0

Interesting question, I wasn't aware of the controversy. I did view the DH's reference site and the one below and all I see is that maybe the original Hebrew really did mean that lions were at his hands and feet and holding him - the lions' teeth pinning his hands and feet in place because that's what lion's teeth do. It was more poetry than prose, so it had to be somewhat economical with words. Pinned is a good image, it evokes the actual puncture from the teeth. But it leaves the way open for people to see a prediction.

2007-07-26 21:55:21 · answer #4 · answered by Anonymous · 0 0

That wasn't the only place that Jesus was mentioned in the Old Testament! Since there is nothing telling us that King David had his hands and feet pierced ( it wasn't a Hebrew form of punishment) , it might be that he was referring to someone else? Maybe?

And maybe God was referring to Himself when He said this?
Psalm 45
6 Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever;
a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.
7 You love righteousness and hate wickedness;
therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions
by anointing you with the oil of joy.

Was God talking to David and called him God, or was David referring to himself as 'God', which would have been blasphemy? Perhaps God was referring to someone else?

You'll have to make up your own mind. If you sign off on anything prophetic, then you have more faith in what you believe than I have in what I believe!

2007-07-26 21:59:47 · answer #5 · answered by Christian Sinner 7 · 0 0

Scholarly explanation, huh.....let me see, how to do this.....David must've had a very influential vision while asleep or in deep meditation.....it overwhelmed him so much, he decided to document the experience.....and against astronomical odds, it just happened to be the very description of the brutal death the Messiah would go through upon His arrival on this planet many years later.....no prophecy here, just numbers, and it's as scholarly as I can get.....I mean like, the odds are just as highly astronomical as an infant being the sole survivor of a commercial airliner crash, yet that has happened also.....straight up sentiments, and blessings to you.....

2007-07-26 21:56:54 · answer #6 · answered by toocoolsnoopy 3 · 0 0

You are obviously referring to Psalm 22....Unfortunately one cannot tell you what King David was thinking when he wrote this he did not leave detailed interpretations, nor is he alive to ask him...the logical scholarly explanation would be that it was a prophecy..otherwise it would all be personal opinion which is totally worthless.

P.S. You spelled scholarly wrong.

2007-07-26 21:54:13 · answer #7 · answered by Nicole B 4 · 0 0

If you look at all of Psalms 22, you will find imagery of the final days of CHRIST.

Psalms 22:6  But I am a worm, and no man; a reproach of men, and despised of the people.

Psalms 22:8  He trusted on the LORD that he would deliver him: let him deliver him, seeing he delighted in him.

Psalms 22:13  They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion.

Psalms 22:13  They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion.
14  I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.
15  My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.
16  For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.

Psalms 22:18  They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.

I don't know if this is to your satisfaction.

GOD bless

2007-07-26 21:52:40 · answer #8 · answered by Exodus 20:1-17 6 · 0 0

You reject all prophecy? Dude, you're going to get a very though time explainig it without assuming he was refering to the carpenter who was crucified 1000 years later.

Paz de Cristo

2007-07-26 21:48:52 · answer #9 · answered by Emiliano M. 6 · 0 0

According to the Jewish Study Bible, this psalm of David is read on Purim and is viewed by Jewish tradition as David lamenting over the future exile of his people.

2007-07-26 21:53:11 · answer #10 · answered by thundercatt9 7 · 0 0

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