"Redemption?" Does xianity thrive on self-loathing?

Question

This came up in one of my earlier questions:

"Repentance is one of the most difficult things I've ever had to face spiritually. It's a complete nightmare. It's about looking into the depths of your soul and seeing the filth, disease and sickness that lie there, and having to admit that it's there because you put all of that garbage there yourself through your voluntary choice to commit sin."

Does this seem . . . "off" . . . to anyone else? To voluntarily see one's self in those terms?

I mean---your religion says you're a horrible, wretched whatever because of "sin" and then offers you a "cure" for what *it* says about you as long as you'll ADMIT and INTERNALIZE that negative opinion about yourself?

Can we all have a look behind "Door #2" instead?

Poohcat----god loves you, but you fall so short of his expectations he had to brutally murder his own son to make it all okay again? How did THAT help?

Answer 1

Many spiritual faiths do this but not from the standpoint of exposing yourself as a miserable dirty maggot that’s an element introduced by people that worship suffering and flog themselves (perhaps not all but that the faith has any indicates an unhealthy outlook)

Buddha taught us to relinquish our ego. Zoroastrians did also. Christians that “got” it did too but many decided to go into that blind ally of masochism in all three ways possible physical, emotional and mental.

It’s like the “Born Again” cult the concept is mentioned only 3 times.
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John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
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John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
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1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

So if this were of such paramount importance then the other gospels should mention it to but they don’t.

Baptism is mentioned 22 times. It’s in all four gospels and scattered through the New Testament. But most “Born Agains” don’t think Baptism is important. Most orthodox faiths do consider it so important that they baptize babies even though the babies aren’t at the age of accountability. So both the “Born-Again” and the “Baptist” cults think something MAGICK happens when they do either of these two things and they doubt the salvation of anyone from the other Cult. It is an unbearably stupid argument.

Both concepts are about the same thing, dying to your ego and replacing it with love. All love comes from God and Gods love is carefully defined.

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Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, [even] in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
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Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

It’s hard to teach from only these scriptures. It’s like trying to tell someone about Jesus but not being able to use any New Testament material because no one knows it.

Get healthy salvation. Avoid the cults.



Blessed Be!

Answer 2

Oh man that answer is just so sad. Look at the guilt layed on that person by a loving god. I don't understand it. Why would anyone worship such an evil being?

I am not the best person in the world but I can think of no 'sin' I ever committed that is worthy of a place like hell.

That answer has truly depressed me. I know what it is like to hate myself. I know that pain and I lived with it by getting drunk everyday for years. It was a result of what was done to me, not what I did to deserve it.

Oh man, this is just sad.

Answer 3

I wouldn't call it self-loathing, I'd just call it taking an honest moral inventory of yourself, with the end purpose being to make you a more loving and sensitive person. We've all done things to hurt others, and the goal is to constantly re-evaluate and work on not doing those things that are harmful to others. I agree with the person you quoted here that the initial evaluation can be brutal. However, you then move on to changing the patterns that you have been using, in order to become a more loving person; you learn how to curb the desire to retaliate against those who've hurt you, and then you learn to forgive without reservation. In some respects, it's like putting a bullet-proof vest around your mind...not allowing the internalization of things that might make you want to behave badly, or retaliate. Once this has been accomplished, you can move on to learning true compassion.

Self-loathing? I think not. More like an epiphany that leads you to become better able to love others, and yourself as a result of that. Nothing feels better than doing only loving things in your dealings with people, regardless of how another acts.

Answer 4

This is what the Gnostic Teacher Valentinus said about Redemption...

"Perfect redemption is the cognition itself of the ineffable greatness: for since through ignorance came about the defect . . . the whole system springing from ignorance is dissolved in Gnosis. Therefore Gnosis is the redemption of the inner man; and it is not of the body, for the body is corruptible; nor is it psychical, for even the soul is a product of the defect and it is a lodging to the spirit: pneumatic (spiritual) therefore also must be redemption itself. Through Gnosis, then, is redeemed the inner, spiritual man: so that to us suffices the Gnosis of universal being: and this is the true redemption."

Answer 5

See, I don't get this kind of thought. Why would one want to believe that they are all of those bad things. I mean unless you have murdered someone or something pretty close, why would you think you are full of filth etc?

To me this is more of that thing where man felt the need to tell people they were all of these bad things. People, some people, bought into it and believe they are. I don't believe we are born with all these bad things to where we need to repent. I think it's a sick thought that people really believe themselves to be bad. My belief is you bring this negative energy to you by believing that it's in you.

I prefer to see my self through light (truth) and not the darkness some religions teach.

Answer 6

The Christian is defined by personal suffering and self-loathing. Once you are broken down to a worthless pile of rat dung, Jesus seems like a great guy (if you had been starving for 4 weeks and only had water the whole time, and someone suddenly came and offered you a stale cracker from Denny's, you would jump for joy at this "great event").

Christianity is a self-sustaining curse, as you are told you have this serious problem called "sin", and the only "cure" is god-man Jesus.

Answer 7

Listen, ya'll....
I used to have a serious drug and alcohol problem and I'm glad I went through a period of serious self-examination while I got sober. That said, it was a journey about learning to love who I AM as opposed to who I was SUPPOSED to be..and I'll be honest, something bigger than me got me sober, and I'm willing to call that "God."
Now MY God told me to accept and love the fact that I am transgendered, as opposed to "defacing God's greatest creation". I'm happy and I'm ME.
I think I prayed to the same God as the Jews, Christians and Muslims...and frankly I'm thinking I'm more of a Buddhist anyway.

Answer 8

It's not so terrible to confess that you have sinned. One need not go over every wrong thing you have done..who could even remember it all anyway?
No, you simply agree with God that you are a sinner in need of salvation. What could be easier then that?
When sin leaves you..you will feel the weight of the world leave off of your shoulders...It's a wonderful life, being a Christian.

Answer 9

I personally don't understand the "low self-esteem" attitudes that some Christians seem to not only have, but take pride in. They're wretches, they're not worthy of God, they're sinners, they always fall short of God, etc.

Answer 10

Isn't "filth, disease and sickness" within very subjective ?

Who decides, a book, A preacher, a politician ? Know thyself and let go of guilt and fear, then the question dissolves into the ether.