Is a concrete/literal description af anything at odds with true spiritual awareness?

Question

Words and mental impression really grasp the true Nature of existence. No mental representation or description or teaching can be the 'thing-in-itself'. So how can there be a 'last word' in anything.
How can being spiritual just be a matter of reaching for a book?

Meant to say words and impressions *can't* really grasp....

I'm not saying a description can't POINT to the truth, bud words on a page or in your head is not a direct EXPERIENCE.

Thanks Jon C,
Your making sense.

It's not that the literal contradicts, but the literal must be transcended.
Ah Jon, I need more clarity,
back to the cushion for me!

Thanks Link,
I must confess my ignorance when it comes to philosophy. I'll try and read up, but it sounds like I got some catching up to do!

Answer 1

Who says it is?


Some people find it hard to articulate their experiences while others don't. Sometimes reading a spiritual book helps to put words on what one has experienced........

Spirituality is always contentious because it is the highest tier of our being - above even our intellect - but we cannot separate ourselves into different compartments such as the "body, mind and spirit" section of a bookstore. We live in a temporal, physical state - we have intellects and we have to evaluate the world and all our experiences within these realms...

Spirituality is best described IMO by Bono as "Instinct over intellect"

Answer 2

Being spiritual is more than just reaching for a book, the Holy Bible. It includes BELIEVING what is written and APPLYING the concepts one grasps from reading to daily life and UNDERSTANDING the messages written there. The messages written in the bible ARE the LAST words and final AUTHORITY for a believer. A concrete description of anything that requires the five human senses does not take any spiritual discernment. However, spiritual discernment may require a literal description of something that occurs, occurred or will occur in the "natural" or the physical realm because mankind is sensual by nature in perception. The answer therefore, is NO: concrete descriptions are not necessarily, at odds with true spiritual awareness but they can be, depending on ones willingness to perceive concrete things figuratively or from a new perspective.

Answer 3

Well you are only about 2400 years behind Socrates, Read Pheadrus' notes, I will come back to you later with a specific reference.

The Jist: Part of the reason Socrates never wrote anything in his teaching is he believed that written words should only act as a reminder to the person that wrote them or a seed to begin the learning, he agreed with you, nothing written can be absolute. Can you ask a book a question for example, it will only give you the same answer over and over again. Any scripture can only be put in true context, when in the hands of its author and they can defend and expand on the written. And the best writing is a stimulation of thought not a definitive answer.

Obviously this was spoken with regards to wisdom, which to Socrates was a spiritual concept, obviously writing about more definitive subjects such as the property's of materiel's, or engineering information can be comprehensive.

Answer 4

Not at odds, necessarily, no.
The temple bell is still the temple bell whether I am in a state of enlightenment or not. The way I perceive it may be different, but that perception goes beyond rather, than contradicts, the concrete/literal. Don't you think?

It's intereting that, in Zen, the concrete/literal is the subject upon which the Master so often insists. Pointing, jabbing, with his finger, "THIS, boy, THIS."
Hopefully 'this' will fade out, allowing, 'Ahh, this!'

Certainly, though, too many people look at a finger which is pointing at the moon and think that they are being shown - a finger!

EDIT,
A great teacher, the cushion.
It might be salutory, when listening to me talking about enkightenment, to remember that 'he who knows does not talk - he who talks does not know'.

Another edit.
RW, would you consider allowing emails? I've got some bits and bobs that might help, being as you're Buddhistically inclined

Answer 5

Light could be the nearest world for wordily people.

Light could be said to be the form. In that state of spiritual void light is everywhere, nothing else is is there only light is there, in that state of conciousness.

However it may sound stupid to most.

Answer 6

Because of your refgusal to believe God and to read and understand the bible, it makes you against God and in favor of satan who is b ringing to the wrong path.
jtm