time for American services to stop ruing 40000 young Americans a year?

Question

the army and other american services are ruining american citezins every year labeling them as criminals and making them 2nd class citizens for the rest of there lifes , by the dishonerable discharges they give out each year some are deserved and most are not. they drive out solders at a rate of thousands a mounth its time for us to take back the goverment reform the services and stop letting them destroy those kids futures. from a long time sgt who has prosessed many discharges and alot of them where just cause there section sgt or plt sgt doesnt like them it must stop now

nco's give recomendations for discpline and it is usually followed get a life if u think all are discharged cause they are disapline cases , example witnessed a solder kicked out cause his wife ran off and didnt pay bills so they booted him for not being disaplined finacially check out abc's report how ft carson is giving out cht 5-13 and telling solders with ptsd that it is as good as a honerable and they will get there benifits , but dont this is a thing going befor congress in session on the 25th , and im from a family of 7 4 served all honerabley plus numerus cousins uncles ect . ... so no i dont have a gripe about that just noticing a treand that is totaly unfair to our younger peple in this country contact cspan and tell them u need this congresional session covered so all can see

this is not about the drug user they deserve to be put out we dont need the drug user in our service

disliked was probely the wrong way to state this was tring to be brief my mistake but ptsd solders returning from combat are being bounced out with 5-13 's instead of being treaded , the statistic for solders entering the army is a 50 percent will be discharged from the army in the first year and alot of them are being put out with discharges that ruin them for the rest of there lifes

a general discharge is still looked unfavorably by future employers are we to ruin a persons life cause they cant run 2 miles in 13 mins

and as for requrters let try talking about a guy in my basic years ago who was told the best way to become a chaplins assistant is to join the cav

and as for recruters let try talking about a guy in my basic years ago who was told the best way to become a chaplins assistant is to join the cav

and as for recruters let try talking about a guy in my basic years ago who was told the best way to become a chaplins assistant is to join the cav

if we are to be profesional solders it needs to start at the top

the abc report im talking about states over 22000 solders put out with 5-13 all return combat vets , pretty black and white to me , all preexesting conditions really kind of fishey to me

Answer 1

, boy u guys sure don't read this guy said he was not talking about the drug addicts what a bunch of dumb asses, 5 -13 is administrative and can be read by the commander over o-4 i do believe instead of nitpicking why don't u address the wrongs that the army is doing, and it sounds like he knows what he is talking about to me a former member of the army spelling mistake not counting , jag stuff is mearly a formality if u put the paperwork in it is usually passed through and u all know it smucks, and no discharges are not automatically upgraded if u were in the service u know that quit misleading the readers, upgrades are few and far between i think he was more talking about ptsd solders being put out and lied to about what that classification entitles

Answer 2

It seems to me being only in the army a year now and looking at our deployment rate, that the army is letting so many people in. Some you'd think would get denied. With the recent surge of troops sent over here in Iraq with me, I can not see why unless there are just causes that the military would kick so many out. You can not kick someone out just because you dislike them then no one would be in the military..trust me. The number you state seems so high. I think if the young people come into the Army or any other branch of the military with the knowledge of what they are getting themselves into a little more clearer than that would decrease the numberr of put outs the military has. A lot of new recruiter think boot camp is summer camp and when they get the realization that play time is long over and they are getting ready for war, there discipline problem starts here. Don't blame the military because people are signing up and it isn't a joy ride like they seem to think. Thats why only 1% of Americans serve. This is not for everybody!!!

Answer 3

Look you have a valid point but let me say this, I am a Ret navy guy who works civil service and I have a security clearance and my supervisor was in the navy and popped on a drug test when he was on active duty got a less than Honorable discharge and guess what he is a WS10 Step 3 and making some serious green. So look there is a reason that many get out on unfavorable conditions. The military has some pretty straight forward guide lines on certain items and every now and a Grey area appears. You want to ease the flow of this then maybe you should be talking the EZ credit stores or car dealers who take advantage of service members as well govt employees. there the ones who send garnishment notices to the commands with the service member or employee knowing until after the fact. As far as getting a bad eval because someone does not like you that is one of the Grey areas. when I was in i know I went through that but if it gets to the extream where one has to be discharged there usually more to the story than one tells you.

Answer 4

If a soldier from any branch gets a Dishonorable, they definitely deserved it. There is an appeals process that goes to a 3rd party outside of the soldiers chain of command that will review the discharge is appealed. Before it gets to that stage the Post Legal office must review the discharge to verify that it is indeed worthy of a Dishonorable.

If anyone has told you they got a dishonorable for no reason, they are lieing. There is no way around it, they are lieing. The Army rarely kicks out PT failures or overweight, and if they do its a general. The soldiers I have seen kicked out for drugs have gotten Other than Honorable.

And as a Sergeant you would not be processing the discharge, at most you would be filling out the paperwork and turning it in to Legal for processing.

Answer 5

Does this include those who get discharges for Marijuana?

What do they think Zero Tolerance means.

The only people who get out of the military on a dishonorable or BCD did something wrong.

It is ALOT Harder than you would think to get a BCD. Murder, Rape, Treason, horrific crimes. We are at war so alot of these crimes are punishable by death. If they get a BCD they are getting off light.

It is not true that people are getting kicked out for being disliked. The Eval system in the Navy is biased but you don't get kicked out for having a bad eval.

Don't believe everything you see on the news.

Remember the 90's when they were targeting hazing in the military. The backlash was on soldiers and sailors the military made it difficult for them to build a cohesive unit since that initiation was used to develop fraternity.

The later after the military suffered the backlash of the hazing bans, the news asked the question "Is the military ready for war?" when they were the major cause for the changes to political correctness in the military.

Not all hazing was good but they changed it so much in a knee jerk reaction that the obsticle course became the confidence course and other things that changed the face of the US military from tough to politically correct.

Edit: Are you talking about Condition existing Prior to service? That isn't a dishonorable discharge. That is a medical dischage under general. that becomes honorable after 6 months. That is a VA problem not really a military one. Yes they are kicking people out with PTSD with no medical care. The VA is not a very good system right now depending on the hospital you get.

It took me a year to be seen by the VA for osteoathritis in both knees caused by a service connected injury and I still don't have disability or a valid fix by date since I am still waiting for compensation to do their paperwork and evaluation.

Yes the VA system is screwed up.

Don't assume that these people are getting dishonorables though, That is misleading. They are getting general discharges under honorable that turn to honorable in 6 months.

Answer 6

1. A dishonorable discharge can only be awarded by a General Court-Martial, not some NCO putting you on report.
In order to appear before a General Court Martial, a pre-trial hearing is held under Article 32 of the Uniformed Code of Military Justice. It's equivalent to a grand jury proceeding in civilian life, but the accused's defense counsel is present. He isn't in a grand jury proceeding. So, if a member was convicted by General Court-Martial and given a Dishonorable Discharge, he sure as hell worked hard for it!
2. A Bad Conduct Discharge can only be awarded by a Special Court-Martial.
3. General discharges under honorable conditions only carry one permanent stigma with it. That's the inability of the service member to re-enlist.
4. Since you seem to have no familiarity with the correct spelling of "dishonorable" I doubt your credentials as a "long time sgt".
5. If these members are being kicked out for drug usage, I say "Bravo". I want sober men on my flanks. Not "dopers".

Answer 7

I just recently retired as a company first sergeant after 21 years of service. I've seen many get kicked out and did it to a few myself. All of them were repeat offenders and well deserving of their early career demise. If anything, we were to leniant on some and gave them a rehabilitative transfer to another company just so they could give other people headaches and have the same result in the end. I even went as far to buy $80 worth of groceries for a young soldier, his wife and kids because he was broke from losing rank and to stupid to stay off drugs and just take care of his family. We had to boot him after his third offense. I surprises me that you need a license to drive but any idiot can have a kid. You are what you make of yourself. You act like a criminal, you make yourself a criminal. You act like a druggie, you get labeled and treated as such. You act like a malcontent - you should get the point by now. Every soldier that I put out was a repeat offender drug user or repeat AWOL. It's not hard to get by in the army. The standards of conduct are clear and easy to achieve with minimal effort. With a little more effort, you can actually improve yourself and your position.

Answer 8

Wow! I'm in the Army, and am 20 years old. I hope I don't have that ahead of me!

I must agree with you, sgt. Our government is in dire need of reform. Whatever happened to the passion and activism of our forefathers? I fear that recent terrorist attacks and hate-motivated violence have primed the American people to willingly relinquish their rights out of fear. This unfortunate state of affairs reaches all the way into our Armed Forces. The system is set up so that young men and women are attracted to the Service without really being able to inform themselves. I could never see an NCO as a predator, but I must admit that many of them are not held accountable for their actions. Certainly, though, these are the exceptions and not the rule.

I love the Army, and, having been raised by a Drill Instructor, I still have faith in it.

Answer 9

come on guys none of you have ever seen a solder put out unfairly get real i saw the report on ABC about ft Carson and all i can say is shame on people treating our veterans like that we have really hit a new low. army recruiting numbers for 2006 is over 80000 and by there own account 50 % is there own stat for failer rate doesnt sound like fiction to me but if u look at it half of this guys 40000 were probily put out for reasonable cercomstanses but that still leaves 20000 getting screwed and that is too mutch,

Answer 10

wow there is no way your numbers are correct. the army needs people right now. i'm in the navy and have seen people get discharged for doing drugs because of our policy but i have seen people in the army stay in after doing coke, weed, heroine among other things. so i'm pretty sure they aren't getting kicked out for be disliked.