a question about Judas...?

Question

All Christians seem to agree that the crucifixion was necessary in order for salvation. In order for this to take place, Judas had to betray Jesus. My question... Why would God's plan involve have Judas as a scapegoat? His betrayal was part of the plan, so really he had NO choice BUT to betray Jesus! Why would a kind, loving God allow a man to be villified throughout history for helping to fulfill God's plan for salvation? You can argue that he had free will, but in essence he didn't, because it was all part of the plan. Why would you want your salvation to ride on the back of this horrible act of betrayal on Gods part?

I read the national geographic article on the Judas gospel..

I can't believe some of the "logic" coming out of the Christians. Look at what you're writing! It doesn't make God sound any better!

God still pulls the strings, And he still needed someone to take the fall... granted he (Judas) did not ask for forgiveness....

Death from above... read my profile. And when is it silly to ask a question?

Answer 1

"Why would a kind, loving God allow a man to be vilified throughout history for helping to fulfill God's plan for salvation?"
Firstly, this is part of the scam - nothing like this ever happened but one could also ask, if Jesus was god and god is all knowing wouldn't it therefore follow that Judas and Jesus were fellow conspirators?
Secondly, the religion allowed the Jews to be the Xians' scapegoat for the death of Jesus. "The Jews killed Christ" and calling the Jews "Christ-killers".
It's the reason so many pogroms happened against Jews throughout history starting in 38AD.
"There were anti-Semitic riots in Alexandria under Roman rule in 38 CE during the reign of Caligula."
"Why would a kind, loving God allow" ... I've yet to see evidence for a kind, loving Invisible Sky Critter let alone any other type.
Both Xian and Islam religions are steeped in violence against all non-believers.

Something quite obvious: without Jesus being betrayed and killed there'd have been no possibility of resurrection and therefore no xian religion and therefore thousands of churchmen would have had to find real jobs.

Answer 2

A lot of discussion has transpired regarding the role of Judas in the new covenant and indeed, he was essential in it coming to fruition.

Somebody had to do it -- it fulfilled a need in the scheme of things. Yes, Judas has been vilified as a 'traitor' but in the areas of repentance and forgiveness he also held a key initial role.

God did not commit betrayal here. The primary betrayal was in the church leadership of the time. Judas was a vehicle and a means to an end.

My salvation is based on the acts committed by Judas and the consequences of the betrayal of the Sanhedrin. It was ordained and foretold in the Old Testament and came true just as it was written, right down to the price -- which also was the cost of a slave in those days.

Say what you like, the price for my salvation was high and paid in full.

Answer 3

Judas did exactly what you and I would have done, for at that moment, Judas did not see with new eyes. But you can believe he did later, and the result of the guilt and shame was his own hanging. God did not pick on Judas as many believe. The default setting of human thought is evil until divine love corrects that situation and takes the lead in one's life. Judas betrayed and the whole human race murdered. Was Judas crime worse than another's crime? God's perfect plan was Christ personified, so evil human thought could start to reject itself, and we could be saved in understanding, substantiated by Jesus' works. Christianity does at length begin to make perfect sense when the smoke clears out.

Answer 4

A conundrum wrapped in an enigma. Unless, God had a 'provisional golf ball' arranged. God arranged a 'provisional' with king saul (that is, David). God had arranged a 'provisional' with Abram and Issac (the ram caught by the horns). Thus, He had to have made Plan B, if judas did not betray Jesus.

Free Will 101: the yes means no-thing; if no is not a possibility. And vice versa. Jesus could have chosen NOT to go to the cross, He could have called legions of angels and wiped everything out. That is part of why I respect and admire Him so much.

Jesus 'knew' that "one of you is a devil"...and later, He knew..."one of you will betray Me"....and when judas got up to do it, Jesus 'knew' what he was going to do and told him to get it done. That does NOT mean that He liked it !! Or, that He is on friendly terms with His betrayer today.

No, again, judas could have said "NO, I will not do this despicable and cowardly act". IF he had done that, God had to have a back up plan. Say something like: one of the sanhedrin schemes with another member or two and they bear false witness and the drama unfolds. This is not unprecedented: think of jezebel and ahab wanting Nabob's vineyard.

Maranantha

Answer 5

Judas had as much free will as any other human who ever lived, including Hitler. The world today would be much different had Hitler never invaded Poland, but not necessarily better. Many, many things came out of WWII and Hitler's actions to see to it that something like that never happened again, one of which was the United Nations. Yet, in light of the good that has come from his actions, should Hitler not be held responsible for his actions, and the actions of those who acted on his orders? What we are free to choose in this life is to serve God or not to. Judas COULD have chosen a different path, and the events surrounding Jesus' death would still have been carried out. Yes, Jesus had to die on the cross as a sacrifice for sin, but Judas did not have to betray Him. Furthermore, Judas COULD have sought forgiveness. Jesus forgave Peter for denying Him, He'd have forgiven Judas as well. Judas chose to commit suicide instead. He could have been a shining example of the truest depths of God's forgiveness. Instead he CHOSE to take the role as the most vile of villains.

Answer 6

Actually, Judas and Peter had a lot in common. Both betrayed Jesus, and both skipped out when the chips were down. The difference is that Peter asked for forgiveness. Judas didn't. He gave up all hope and hung himself. THAT was the real reason Judas is villified. He thought he could force Jesus' hand, and when it backfired, his pride caused him to fall.

Answer 7

The notion that because God knew what Judas would do that he was therefore compelled to do it is illogical. The truth is God uses the choices of men to work out His own will whether those choices are in accord with His will or not. He knew Satan would instigate the murder of Jesus, yet He used it to accomplish the salvation of Mankind through his atoning sacrifice. How Satanic of you to accuse God of evil in the matter rather than Judas. Isn't this the very reason why God will also judge you?

Answer 8

It was part of God's plan, but Judas still had a choice. God, who is all-knowing, knew that Judas would betray Jesus.

God is never suprised by our mistakes, even today. Dont let something like that stop you from seeing God's awesome love and the fact that He carried your sin and died for your faults and mistakes so that you could be free of condemnation and receive everlasting life.

Jesus loves you and cares for you, even if you curse or deny Him, you would have a chance to accept Him.. as long as you live.

Hope that helps you..

Answer 9

Two things to understand: He knew the end from the beginning, and God creates both the evil and the good to accomplish His will. Read in Exodus, for example, where it clearly states that GOD hardened Pharoah's heart to accomplish what He wanted to accomplish in Egypt. A lot of people think they are in control of their lives, but they are not. He knew us before we were born on this earth, and knows what we will be doing to accomplish HIS WILL.
Its like the saying I post occasionally on these boards: I love atheists, because they PROVE there is a God. For if there were no God, there would also be no atheists. Judas proves a point: even the likeness of God was RIGHT IN FRONT OF HIM, he betrayed Him still. So what are most people who SAY they believe doing today???

Answer 10

God was not the betrayer, that was Judas....the Lord already knew Judas would betray Him, because Judas was the son of perdition. What was He supposed to do, supernaturally change Judas...that's why it was free will. Does God tell YOU that you HAVE to believe and you have NO choice...

That's like you doing something hideous like burning your dog. If you suddenly decided to do something so horrible as to burn your own dog do you think God is going to step in a prevent it? We all make our own choices in life...