How come the fundementaltist go nuts when?

Question

You make a critisisim of their faith based on the number of areas where they are found wanting (Bible authority, 35000 denominations etc etc )

Yet they are so happy and think they have the God given right to tell everyone else that they are wrong.

I think in general these groups collect disadvantaged people from society and tell them what to believe.

I would challange them to explore truth a little more. No where does the bible say that it is the sole authority. In fact it says that it is not and needs to be interpreted based on church tradition.

Before the undeducated jump in (as they do on this site) Catholics do not pray to mary, they only pray to GOD. They believe in Salvation through christ only and only through grace.

What your pastor and minister told you or what you heard in your cell group was a lie. and if you were once catholic then you never understood the true faith.

Come on show me some love.

Note: Catholics ask saints to pray for them in much the same way you would ask a friend.

If it is wrong to ask a saint to pray for you then what right do you have to ask a pastor.

Think about it you are baseing a lot on a very limited a shallow understanding of history and chruch doctine mixed with limited bible understanding.

The catholic church can easily trace its roots back to Jesus himself.

For those of you who like to quote revelations 22. It might be worth noting that it was written before all the other books in the bible. So you cant say dont add anything, get it.

Answer 1

Fundie infallibility or papal infallibility, its still all bogus

Answer 2

Undeducated, tsk, tsk, tsk. I hope you mean uneducated and not undedicated. Uneducated I may be, that is open for discussion. Undedicated? I must protest!

Catholics do not pray to mary? Really? Want to take a bet?
I will take you on a trip through south europe and we will do some investigation. Who loses the bet pays the bills. I know some good restaurants and hotels over there. They are not all expensive.

The majority of catholics pray to mary and if you are a catholic and educated you must know. When asked about the subject, the clergy gives it a twist saying undeducated (pick your choice) only ask mary to intervene with her son. Is Jesus too busy? Is he a popstar who can not be disturbed? Is he a stock market guru for whom time is money?

No my dear Bill the truth is that catholics have found out that the key to mass manipulation is irrationality. That is why many of the other christian denominations (protestants e.g.) will never win the market: they are too rational, too dry. That is why the catholic church is losing ground to more swinging churches. People want emotion, blood and tears.

The adoration of mary verges on mass hysteria. It was a godsend (!) for the vatican. I will show you.

Pack your suitcase and do not forget a few golden credit cards. I fly only first class.

Hmm, charcoaled seabass on a small terrazza near the sea and a few good bottles of Veneto.

Answer 3

"Take note on those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ...see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God...they abstain from the eucharist and from prayer, because they do not confess the eucharist IS the flesh of our Lord Jesus Christ...wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the catholic church."
Ignatius of Antioch A.D. 110
You know, the closer you get to the time of Christ, the more the church resembles the Catholic church. I'll tell you why all these cult members and other heretics hate the Catholic church. Their pastors have done a superb brainwashing job, perverting what the bible says. Quoting from obscure passages, out of context of course, they indoctrinate with venom and lies about the holy church. Pay them no attention. Their absurdity is self-effacing.

Answer 4

I liked Giovanni Geezus remark "Catholicism is just as fake as God is". Clearly a true believer, since Catholicism undeniably exists.

To Kat: Rev 22:18-21 make no claim that the Bible is the sole authority, and is only a warning to those who would modify "the book of this prophecy" - i.e. the Book of Revelation.

To the asker:

1) Not sure how "bible authority" finds them "wanting". Seems to me like that would do just the opposite.

2) Do *you* get upset when someone mentions the 35,000 denominations of Christianity? Do you feel that your faith is "found wanting"? After all, most fundamentalist sects are not responsible for the existence of any other fundamentalist sect, and the reason most sects exist is because of the inappropriate actions of the RCC in history (particularly in Luther's time). The one sect of Christianity most responsible for the sectarianism of Christianity is the RCC. This is an extremely unfortunate truth, but a truth nonetheless. Luther himself did not desire to create a new sect, but rather to reform the existing church.

3) *I* don't feel that *I* have the "God-given right to tell everyone else that they are wrong". But then, I am currently not the member of any specific sect.

4) "I think in general...". If that's what they are doing, then they might be doing good. After all, that's what Jesus did.

5) "no where in the bible does it say that it is the sole authority". This is true, and for obvious reasons. For one, the bible was not assembled until the 4th century, centuries after the books of the bible were written. For another, it is safe to assume that the authors of the bible books did not think that their book(s) were the final word.

I am unaware of any verse which states (or even implies) that the bible is *not* the sole authority. Since all the books of the bible were written centuries before the existence of the bible, the bible is mute on that point.

I know of no place in the bible that makes the claim that bible or scripture "needs to be interpreted based on church tradition". The only place in the NT I know of that mentions tradition in a non-negative manner is when Paul is discussing men's and women's hair. Certainly *I* know of no bible passage which says that scripture should be interpreted according to any tradition, church or other. Please supply scriptural references when you claim that scripture supports your belief.

6) Many RCs, in accordance with church doctrine, do pray to Mary for her intercession with God. They also pray to the other saints' intercession with God. The RC catechism is quite explicit about this. Your use of the work "ask" is disarming, since that is exactly what the word "pray" means. Consider the Hail Mary - undeniably a prayer *to* Mary. When you say this prayer, you *pray* that Mary prays "for us sinners". Your take on this is definitely not in accord with RC doctrine. The RC catechism is invaluable - read it. I would also recommend the companion volume, but that's really only for hard-core fundamentalist Christians like myself. :)

Jim, http://www.jimpettis.com/wheel/

Answer 5

I was raised Catholic, went to Catholic grade and high school. Here is what I observed from most of the individuals that I knew then and now(some of my best friends are Catholic). They know almost nothing of the bible or the gospel. They think that they are going to heaven because they are a Catholic. I'm not saying they are bad people, in fact, most are great people. What I am saying is, The Church membership is their salvation.

Answer 6

Sometimes a person puts so much time and energy and social investment into a set of beliefs ( probably in order to be accepted into a local community) that to deny it is to deny who they have become. And with denial they would face rejection from the community to which they have given so much time.

And so they dare not think that they have made a mistake.

Doubly so, if the belief has been since an indoctrinated childhood.

They are not open to persuasion unless they themselves have become totally disillusioned by the self-serving of the church politicians.

The aim of Free-Thinkers is to disillusion them by bringing into their knowledge the corruption of the whole thing.

Answer 7

Bill, the Bible doesn't say "according to church tradition".

2 Peter 1:20 "knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation."

1 John 2:27 "but the annointing that ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same annointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him"

The HOLY SPIRIT TEACHES to all that has accepted the outpouring of God's Spirit into their hearts and lives for THIS VERY PURPOSE...that NO MAN has control over God's children's minds, hearts, bodies, souls, or Spirits.

I am sorry, brother, but each individual has the key to God's Kingdom right in their hands and they can use it without another telling them when they can or can't.

Peace be with you :)

***Midge...the Bible says to pray for each other:

James 5:16 "Confess your faults one to another, and pray for one to another, that ye may be healed..."

I am also sorry to say, but only the Catholic Bibles have the "magnificat" or "Mary's song" or whatever...(I may have misspelled? sorry)

Answer 8

My friend, surely neither of us want to go back to the days of paying priests in advance for absolution of sins we plan to commit. The fact is the Catholic church in Luther's time became corrupt. The bible was translated into the language of the common man and the rest is history. My bible tells me to work out my own salvation with fear and trembling. What does yours tell you?

Answer 9

I think it is very interesting that fundamentalists deny The Virgin Mary's ability to intercede for us and then turn around and ask each other to pray for them. They treat the Blessed Virgin like trash and I would be willing to bet the Lord is not too happy with that. The same Bible that they swear by even says in the Magnificat (Mary's song) My soul doth glorify the Lord my spirit rejoices in God my savior, for he has looked upon the lowliness of his handmaid and henceforth all generations will call me Blessed....
They don't even call her Blessed

Answer 10

I read something somewhere that indicated that 75% of the population in the world can trace themselves back to royalty in England from the 600's. Go back even further and I am betting the percentage increases. So tracing anyone's origins to the relatives from 2000 years ago isn't that impressive.

Answer 11

"All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." (2 Timothy 3:16-17)

2 Tim 3:17 says that the scripture will "equip us for every good work". It does Not say that scripture will "equip us for MOST good works". It does not say that scripture will "equip us PARTIALLY for good works".

If sola Scriptura cannot be the correct method of determining truth because of the religious division among churches that claim to use sola Scriptura, then does this not also disqualify the Roman Catholic and Orthodox churches method of using tradition, since they are divided against themselves?