.... does that mean that the protestant, anglican, episcopalian, orthodox, amish, baptist, lutherian, presbytherian, and seventh-day adventists denominations should now be considered as sects, clubs, lobbies, bands, cohorts, gangs, clans, hooligans or tribes ?
Original BBC article (july 10th '07):
Vatican text angers Protestants
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6289014.stm
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2007-07-10 08:53:41 · 14 answers · asked by par1138 • FCD 4 in Society & Culture ➔ Religion & Spirituality
Actually the document claims the Orthodox are true churches. Protestant communities are considered ecclesial communities and not churches. It is getting technical, but Protestants, instead of being angry should be self-reflective.
He will not permit reunion with Protestants unless they return to both the form and substance of the early Church. Reading the writings of those who were trained and knew the apostles, such as Clement the third Pope, Polycarp who was a redactor for John's Gospel, and Ignatius of Antioch, you cannot end up with anything like Protestantism unless you fool yourself or carefully pick and choose specific passages and do not look at their writings as a whole.
He is saying Protestants must reform themselves in the ancient model and are not free to do anything they want. At last count, there were 42,000 Protestant denominations all believing to be the correct Church. Some Protestants believe in baptism, some do not; some require foot washing, some do not; some have communion, some do not; some require snake handling, some do not; some require speaking in tongues, some do not; some permit women ministers, some do not; some use 66 books, some have used 63( Luther threw out James, Jude and Revelations), and some use 73; some use the bible extensively in their services as do Catholics, some never even quote once from it; some have bishops, some do not; some have deacons and some do not; some have presbyters and some do not; some only speak if the spirit moves them and some are loud and boisterous and many are in the middle. When the Massachusetts Supreme Court ruled in favor of gay marriage, they cited the Puritans who created the first marriage law. The law explicitly states that marriage is not from God and is not a religious act. It is a contract governed by the State alone. Of course many Protestants are now flipping out over the sanctity of marriage. Protestantism has become a hodgepodge of nothingness. Protestantism is a meaningless concept and will only make sense if it returns to the first and original practices of what was considered orthodox Christianity.
He is saying look deeply at yourself, what are you and why are you there. You must fix yourself and return to that early Church, not as it is interpreted to exist by your denomination but as historians show it existed.
To Orthodox he is saying that honorary authority is not sufficient to protect the Church, that that idea is defective and results in meaningless antagonisms. He does in other documents agree that papal authority needs materially reviewed to remove historical accretions, but Peter clearly has a unique role given by Jesus that the other eleven do not share.
2007-07-10 09:12:08 · answer #1 · answered by OPM 7 · 3⤊ 0⤋
No, thank goodness. The church is created from all believers in Christ, no longer purely a particular few. i became raised in a pseudo-Christian cult and found out that as quickly as you hear "that's the only genuine church" to run, no longer walk, in the different direction. Worship the Lord, no longer the employer you belong to. learn the Bible, no longer a sheet of doctrines or a "assertion of theory." Weigh each and every thing by ability of the word of God, and reject what does not sq. up.
2016-10-01 07:53:41 · answer #2 · answered by Anonymous · 0⤊ 0⤋
Here is the full text of the new document that states nothing new: http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20070629_responsa-quaestiones_en.html
Most Christian denominations believe that each of them is the fullest version of the Church of Christ.
While the Catholic Church also believes that she is "the highest exemplar" of the mystery that is the Church of Christ, she does not claim that non-Catholic Churches are not truly Christian. The Catholic Church teaches:
Furthermore, many elements of sanctification and of truth are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements.
Christ's Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church.
All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him.
With love in Christ.
2007-07-10 17:47:58 · answer #3 · answered by imacatholic2 7 · 1⤊ 0⤋
The statement is one of self-definition for the Catholic Church and clarifies for those Catholics, whose work is in terms of the dialogue of the Catholic Church with other Christians and religions, the Catholic Church's self-understanding. As far as what other Christians want to identify as being the church or their theological definition of the church, that is up to those Christians. As far as Protestant rejection of the Vatican statement-- isn't that what constitutes Protestantism itself-- a a protest against the papacy and Roman Catholic Church?
2007-07-10 09:02:50 · answer #4 · answered by Timaeus 6 · 2⤊ 1⤋
He's an eighty year old man who just got through inciting the muslims with a hateful statement, and he had to go to Turkey to unconfuse himself. So, now he's compensating by infuriating fellow Christians.
Jesus is my mediator...thank God!
2007-07-10 09:03:55 · answer #5 · answered by Thomas Paine 5 · 1⤊ 1⤋
Not just because the pope says so. We are called upon to examine and consider, not just believe because someone posing as a religious leader says so.
2007-07-10 08:58:37 · answer #6 · answered by Mister J 6 · 1⤊ 1⤋
I have long since given up paying any attention to Vatican pronouncements. They typically range from irrelevant to stupid.
2007-07-10 08:57:58 · answer #7 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 2⤋
It means nothing, just puffing himself up.
2007-07-10 09:09:01 · answer #8 · answered by ? 7 · 0⤊ 0⤋
They are considered communities, or the more proper name would be ecclesial communities.
2007-07-10 08:59:14 · answer #9 · answered by The Raven † 5 · 1⤊ 1⤋
We call them Communities. According to our understanding, Churches have apostolic succession.
http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20070629_responsa-quaestiones_en.html
2007-07-10 08:59:08 · answer #10 · answered by Anonymous · 1⤊ 2⤋