Concepts, beliefs and knowing, oh my!?

Question

Concepts are ideas that may or may not be believed. We often grasp a concept because we want to believe it, and say we believe it, but our experience may show us differently, and mind believes what it's experience demonstrates.

We may say we believe in God, or that life is illusion, mind, duality, self is illusion, but we continue to act as though there is no God and life and self are very real. We do this because that's what mind truly believes to be so. There are concepts which make sense and we would like to believe, and there is what we truly believe and respond to in our daily lives. Seems to me It's important to know the difference.

Beliefs are not knowing. Mind can never really know anything absolutely because creation and perception are the same. The act of perceiving is a movement in Consciousness that creates that perception, much the same way you create your nightly dreams. There is a level at which mind knows it can know nothing for certain.
Okay, running out of roo

Gnostic and all:
Just wondering what you think about the "manifesto". You're free to offer an opinion even if there isn't a clear cut question. I know, breaking the rules. My bad. :(

JON:
That's great! Every once in a while I can know nothing, but most of the time I don't really know that. Hehe.

Answer 1

I wonder if there isn't some strange paradox here (as opposed to a normal paradox?) in that perhaps Knowledge is less to do with head and more to do with heart?

I'd say that gives me something to ponder, but now I'm thinking perhaps there's no point? *grins* Oh my indeed!

Namaste.
.

Answer 2

I would make an alteration on the definition and connection
between the three(concept, belief, knowing). Belief and
knowing being on opposite ends of a scale of measure,
and concept being the indicator which marks the
measure. For example, with God I believe God exists,
but God being beyond human rationale implies that
I can't fully conceptualize God. Therefore, I don't have
enough concept to state that I know God because God
is beyond the extent of my conceptualization. Generally
speaking, the stronger the conceptualization in a
given area the stronger the knowing in that area.
With that in mind, I am capable, as any individual,
in fully conceptualizing myself and for this reason
I know myself.

"There are concepts which make sense and we would like to
believe, and there is what we truly believe and respond to in
our daily lives. Seems to me It's important to know the
difference."

For me, there are concepts which make sense and I believe,
and there is what I know and respond to in my daily life.
I would favor that which I know rather than that which I
believe if both of the two are equally applicable in the
given situation. I do use that which I believe in daily
life, but only when necessary for completing the picture.
For example, if I open the door to my house and I see
half a car within the window of view looking outside
then I know I see half a car and I believe I see a
whole car.
I agree that beliefs are not known, but are based
on a partial knowing.
I don't agree that consciousness creates perception;
creation based on perception begins with interpretation
of what is perceived. Again, consider the example of the
fore-mentioned car. I perceive through the sense of sight
half a car and I create the other half of the car by my
interpretation of the partial picture which I perceive.
The mind's certainty is limited by the certainty that
the senses are properly transporting information to
the mind.

Answer 3

My beliefs include agnosticism, deism, gnosticism, and spiritualism. I believe in God, reincarnation, psychics, the gnostic gospels, and there are many roads to God. As you can see there is no one label that fits me.

Do I know that what I believe is fact? No, of course not. I go by what makes sense to me. I discard idiotic dogma and rules.

How do I point to discrimination based on sexual orientation and call it bigotry without showing my judgment and bigotry towards religion?

I despise bigotry and the feelings of superiority that religions that claim to be the only true way foster in people. Yet, I feel superior because I hate bigots.

I struggle with this daily. Unfortunately, I have been known to lose my temper at the fundies here. I am a flawed human too.

Answer 4

As for my understanding, action is the only way to change true belief of self. Act as if there is God and live life as the self is an illusion. You (anyone) have the power to create your own life, you have all the authority to do so. If there is no action, authority has no use.
... Did I understand the question correctly? If not, oh too bad ^.^
(I always thought English is soooo difficult!)

Answer 5

If a belief is not translated in a direct experience. Its useless.

Illusion of one is actual existence for another. People r placed at different levels on the ladder of spirituality. At every higher level happenings and indulgences at lower level seems stupid. At some levels people indulge in their own concepts & fancies of higher levels.

Wise people help people at lower levels rise, as they have experienced the levels above. Ignorant people can only fool others as they have not experienced the levels above.

Life in everyone is sacred and same.

Answer 6

I agree!

There is nothing more to say....except we learn to respect all life and we learn to understand that our way is not the only way.

We all live, and experience and change....and we always will.

To live in the moment...to enjoy what is now....this is a natural way of continuing on a peaceful journey. Knowing that there is always more to learn....more to experience....change is constant....Love never fails.

(ok...so there was a bit more to say). :)

Answer 7

Interesting...


To believe, is not always to know a truth.

To know a truth is to believe also.

"Let not him who seeks cease until he finds, and when he finds he shall be astonished. Astonished he shall reach the Kingdom, and having reached the Kingdom, he shall rest. And the Kingdom of heaven is within you and whosoever knoweth himself shall find it. And, having found it, ye shall know yourselves that ye are sons and heirs of the Father, the Almighty, and shall know yourselves that ye are in God and God in you."

Answer 8

There are facts that would be facts with or without a single sentient being to observe them.

Take comfort in that.

Answer 9

Yep!
It's the difference between knowing about. . . and Knowing!
(At least, I think it is).
I just came down from meditating and I didn't know anything at all.

Answer 10

Nice manifesto but what's your question?