judo, jujitsu, or catch wrestling?

Question

i have noticed that judokas usully get the upper hand, when competing ageanst a jujitsu guy. I'm also noticing that catch wrestlers usully get the upper hand on judokas.

-WHAT GRAPLING STYLE DO YOU LIKE THE MOST? dosent have to be any of the ones i listed. in another words wich grappling style is the best. dont say there is no best style, think of it as wich grappling syle has the best grappler.
and dont say depends on the rules. the rules are just grapping, no hiting.
- who is the best grappler?
-info:
Ad Santel, who studyed catch wrestling, beat many judoka some are Tokugoro Ito and Reijiro Nagata

Masahiko Kimura, a judoka, beat brazilian jujitsu (its not traditional jujitsu, but its a style of jujitsu) guys helio gracie and Valdemar Santana.

- if you dont balive the info look it up. oh yeah, Tokugoro Ito suposably beat Ad Santle in a remach, but it cant be officaly proven. So, that dosent count, for all one knows that could have be a romer spread by his buddys.

Kimora was 5 ft 7 and 187 lb. He beat Santana. Santana was 6 feet tall, and weighed 205 lb.

Answer 1

Well as far as Judo vs. Jujitsu: No holds barred matches between Judoka and Jujitsuka happened many times in early part of Judo's foundation, regular matches were set up between the Kodokan and various Jujitsu schools, as well as against the Police forces (strong Jujitsuka), hence the reason Judo became Japanese Police Forces art of choice.

Judo vs. BJJ: Kimura did have a significant weight advantage over Helio (however breaking his arm come with skill) that wasn't a Judo style competetion (would have been over the second Kimura slammed Helio with is O Soto), the rules were simply no strikes. Kimura owned him pretty bad, multiple throws and breaking his arm. But Kimura was also a speciman, and one of the better Judokas of all time.

Especially considering that time frame Judokas were going around the world doing challenges (Kimura himself did quite a few before and after Helio) whereas the Gracies were just getting their feet wet. Experience also had a lot to do with Kimura's domination over Helio.

The problem with Judo vs. BJJ is that as long as it starts off standing the edge goes to the Judoka who will control the takedown, having the BJJ practioner having to start at a disadvantage.

I can tell you from personal experience I won many NAGA intermediate and expert matches against pure BJJ due to my Judo experience.

Catch wrestling: I would hardly call it a Judo beater yet, there really hasn't been that many "True" Catch guys competing, much less against quality Judoka. Unfortunately not a whole lot of them compete at any major level. Which is a shame because the venues for Submission grappling are higher now than ever. You ahve NAGAs, and Abu Dhabi (which is the cream of the crop).

Hard to find "real" Catch wrestlers, many people try to capitolize on it. Karl Gotch is the real deal, however not a lot of competetion behind him to speak of.

I think there is some great stuff in Catch, however a lot of it is gimmicky, and I hardly see it handily defeating a world class Judoka, or BJJer. However I love many of the techniques, and incorporate some of it in my game.

So until a Catch Wrestler beats Minotauro Nogeira, or Yoshida, Yamashita, or even Nastula, or Rickson Gracie. Then I would hardly put it over BJJ or Judo.

I don't like any one over the others, I think a combination of all of them is the way to go.

Grappling isn't just the ground only, it is the take down and defense of it. You have to have the full deal to be a good grappler.

A good Judo school cross trains with BJJ, and spends as much time on the mat as they do standing up.

So if I had to choose one, I would probably pick Judo. But I am biased, and was fortunate enough to come from a really good Judo school that was training with Brazilian Jujitsu guys before the UFC ever aired.

Answer 2

Honestly the best is a mix of all 3. But the best I'd have to say in order is judo, wrestling, then jujitsu. Reason being is judo is sort of a mix of wrestling and jujitsu. I also had first hand experience of a friend and teammate from high school wrestling in Taylor Takata. He was a judo national champ who came out for wrestling in 9th grade. Not knowing anything in wrestling he held his own even in his first year as he relied on his superior balance, speed, strength, and throws. And was a 2 time state champ in wrestling when it was all said and done with no one really taking him down. Might I add he should be in the Olympics next summer. So maybe I'm comparing things to a exceptional athlete.

It also depends on what you define as a good grapple. From my experience in tournaments, most winners rely on take downs to win as most matches go to a decision. Judo give the person the ability to take down someone with the knowledge to choke out a person or defend from it.

Answer 3

What he said...

Catch wrestling is a hard thing to track down. And Not all Judoka beat Jujutsuka. And the rules do matter, because a point based event will be slanted towards Judoka, as takedowns count higher than everything else but reversals on the ground. And a submission based event is slanted towards BJJ, as most Judoka still don't train as hard on the mat as Jujutsuka. But if you could find a great freestyle or catch wrestling school AND get BJJ training, you'd be well on your way to pwning. Catch and freestyle give such great takedown defense, good takedowns, and great "riding" training, while BJJ shows awesome positional skills, reversals, and submissions. It's the best of both worlds. And if you wanted to go MMA? Freestyle, BJJ, and Muay Thai would set you for life. Get good at all three and you're a beast.

Answer 4

If you can locate a source for authentic catch wrestling I'd go there. The two I can think of, Matt Fuery and Tony Cecchine, have questionable credentials at best.

Judo throws, jiu jitsu guard and chokes, catch submissions with wrestling takedowns. Each has one aspect where it excels ahead of the others, but once again a credible catch source may be hard to find.
Ken Shamrock and the lion's den may be a the closest thing to authentic catch wrestling with a pedigree in the States.

Answer 5

You think Kimura might have had a slight strength advantage?? When playing by judo rules, judoka will usually beat bjj practitioners, but judo competitions are not the same as submission grappling competitions. Bjjers practice mostly on the ground, and judoka practice mostly takedowns. Thus for submission grappling, bjj > judo.

Both judo and jiujitsu use a gi, and catch wrestling does not. Thus, for no-gi grappling, catch wrestling would win the majority of the time.

Answer 6

I think BJJ, Judo and Catch are all great. I will mention that I did some Catch moves on opponents at a BJJ school and freaked them the hell out. They were within the rules of BJJ but they never saw these moves and didn't know how to defend against them. Although I think BJJ is great, one of the reasons it totally dominated at first is because non BJJ guys didn't know how to defend against it, now they do. Most people don't know how to defend against Catch so in a sense it could dominate like BJJ did. Unfortunately there are very few schools.

Answer 7

I don't do a "grappling" style, though my style of Karate does have some grappling, it's not as thorough as Judo or Jujitsu. My favorite though to observe has been Daito-ryu Aikijujitsu.

Answer 8

Danzan jujitsu.

Answer 9

BJJ. Marcelo Garcia and, of course, Rickson Gracie.

Answer 10

Holy Crap! Kimura beat Santana too?
Sorry... I knew he beat Helio, but I had no idea about the latter.
I like all of the style listed. A mix of all three would greatttt-t. :p