When asking who the best Heavyweight Champion was, Joe Louis' name comes up often, though Ali's does more often. Had Joe Louis never made his comeback (in which he went 8-2 with 3 KOs) he would have retired with a 61-1 record with 52 KOs. His one loss was a fluke vs Max Schmeling. If he never took on Max the first time, he would have retired at 61-0, if he would have beaten Schmeling the first time he'd have been done at 62-0. On top of this great achievement, he won the title on June 22nd 1937, and retired it on March 1st 1949, giving him nearly a 12 year reign as Champion. Also defending his belt 26 times (most say 25 and wikipedia has him at 27, I am going off of boxrec).
In conclusion would a guy named Joe Louis, who retired with a record of 61 or 62-0 with a record (nearly) 12 year reign (the record still stands in EVERY division) and a record 26 title defenses (the record still stands in EVERY division) be universally recognised as the greatest Heavyweight Champion ever?
2007-06-28 06:48:07 · 11 answers · asked by Anonymous in Sports ➔ Boxing
I have Joe Louis as my best heavyweight who never really talke jive he just went in and handled business, and if you got hit you were threw. I love Ali and for what he brought back to a diminishing boxing scene back in the sixties, but Joe Louis erased what Jack Johnson created back when he was champion and made all races love him during his reign as champion. I personaly feel he should be recognised as a universal champion his accomplishments speak for itself: 25 str8 title defenses held the title for 12 years only losing once in his prime and if you did get a rematch when he was in his prime he made you pay. I personally say give the Brown Bomber his just dues he made a lot of fans proud......
2007-06-28 09:21:27 · answer #1 · answered by Devon P 4 · 2⤊ 0⤋
Blogbaba sends a thumbs up to jazbac, great answer, and another to Ric, good to read another of your questions, insightful and deep as always.
It would be pretty hard to argue with a 61-0 undefeated record by a champion who's reign spanned 12 years. When you take into account the political significance of the 2nd Schmeling fight, and Joe's military service it is easy to understand why Louis is mentioned with Ali and Johnson as the greatest heavyweight of all time.
Both Jonhson and Ali impacted politically outside the ring as well to certain degrees but Louis was universally loved across the board and was big enough to actually defeat racisim, a victory neither Ali or Johnson can claim. I don't know if any other man in history outside of religious figures ever did that. Joe Louis is still beloved by nearly everyone who knew or even knew of him.
The only real deciding factor from a boxing standpoint is the level of competition that three boxers faced during their careers. Ali can than thank Joe Frazier, George Forman, Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, Kenny Norton and Archie Moore for the esteem boxing experts attribute to him as much as his own skills. Joe never faced that type of competition, nor did Jack Johnson and it is that factor more than anything else that give Ali a slight edge over Louis or Johnson.
Joe is universally recognised in Detroit, with both a monument and an arena named after him. I looked at the marble statue of Joe at Ceasers the last time I was in Vegas, and got all choked up. He was a great man, and a great champion. The argument as to who was the "best" heavyweight of them all will never end, and it shouldn't, it gives old men sitting by the fire (or in this case the computer) something to argue about.
2007-06-28 14:16:04 · answer #2 · answered by blogbaba 6 · 1⤊ 0⤋
Yes Ric had Louis not made his comeback he would have had a tremendous record of 61-1-52 ko's losing only to Schmeling. The only problem is that his loss although he avenged it in tremendous fashion was no fluke as Schmeling saw a flaw and exposed it. You just can't take that away from Max. He of course did defend his title 25 times in a nearly 12 year span and arguably the greatest heavyweight champion of all time. As it stands he still makes a solid case as being the greatest ever!
2007-06-28 20:46:52 · answer #3 · answered by toughguy2 7 · 1⤊ 0⤋
A very credible argument can be made that Joe Louis was the greatest heavyweight ever. Another argument is, obviously, Ali. When Ali was young and known as Cassius Clay, he would connect with his opponent 100 times and not get hit once. He redefined how a heavyweight could fight. And when he slowed down in later years, he still could beat the best (Frazier, Norton, Foreman, Shavers), although he did get beaten too.
2007-06-28 14:08:03 · answer #4 · answered by Stephen L 6 · 0⤊ 0⤋
Joe Louis knew how to cut off"the ring" he could move well when needed, he had power in both hands, he didn't fight scared like Liston did either. When Liston lost he was beat mentally and physically and Louis got beat when his body broke down from age and once he was on the way up he looked past Max Schmelling.
Taeth, you're free to like Ali all you want to but goddamit Joe Louis was a Great boxer
2007-06-28 14:51:26 · answer #5 · answered by ? 3 · 4⤊ 0⤋
A lot has been said about Ken Norton not getting decisions over Ali, but everyone seems to forget one of the biggest robberies is When Joe Lous got the decision over Jersey Joe Walcott. Walcott clearly won that fight. Ali would have done the same to Joe Louis and much more besides. I believe that Joe Louis has been one of the best heavyweights in history but in my opinion he is behind Ali.
2007-06-28 18:30:34 · answer #6 · answered by claret 4 · 0⤊ 2⤋
I gotta go with Jazbac on this.
To be fair, Ali took boxing to the stratosphere by which it had never seen before. After Ali, interest in boxing soared....creating the Sugar Ray Leonards and others that went on to greatness.
But....Joe Louis came up during an era when heavyweights were gods. And I have to disagree with "the level of competition" that Ali faced. Ali fought some SERIOUS bums, with a few names that he created to be truly great. If you tell me that names like Lancer Johsnon, Jurgen Blin, Zora Folley and Orvill Qualls define his career as better competition...Im gonna have to disagree.
Most of the "great fights" Ali had were about Ali himself. Had Ali NEVER, EVER returned to the boxing game after his forced retirement...we would know names like Ken Norton, Jerry Quarry, George Foreman and Joe Frazier in passing. Many would call Joe Frazier a bum by the terrible beating he took by George Foreman. Ken Norton was the Hasim Rahman of his time.
Most of those fights, people came to see Ali be Ali. But to tell me that any of his competition could be heavyweight champions during any time? I think thats stretching it a bit.
2007-06-28 14:23:23 · answer #7 · answered by kieran27 5 · 4⤊ 1⤋
Joe Louis IS the greatest heavyweight champion ever! Ali is just the most famous. Louis did not grow up in the era of hype. He wasn't a shameless self promoter. He just went about his business whuppin' everybody for about 15 straight years!
2007-06-28 14:10:28 · answer #8 · answered by Anonymous · 3⤊ 1⤋
i think you got a great point ric he could make a fight for the best ever so could ali of course and dempsey and marciano but those four are the only ones as of now id consider. joe louis was a great champion and if not the best one of them.
thanks
~Cherokee74
2007-06-28 13:55:06 · answer #9 · answered by Cherokee74™ 2 · 1⤊ 0⤋
Not at all, it still stands that he didn't face the level of competition that Ali faced and beat, so he would always be #2. Records are just numbers.
2007-06-28 14:03:04 · answer #10 · answered by mowglieboy 3 · 1⤊ 3⤋