What if? Rocky Marciano had of kept fighting?

Question

Rocky Marciano retired april 27 1956. He was knocked down only twice in his career, by Jersey Joe Walcott and Archie Moore. He came back to k.o. each of them. Ezzard Charles was the only man to last 15 rounds with him. Now the question, had he not retired at 33 and continued, beating contenders, Patterson. Johanssen and eventually a overrated Liston ( Which Rock would have been 36-37 by that time) then retired with a 55-0 record, would he receive the respect he deserves? Or would people in yahoo answers think he was still overrated and fought only old men? Remember Patterson stayed at light heavy until Rock retired and Ali knocked out Moore years after Marciano did. And footnote, Moore trained Ali before he fought him! So why does a man who goes 49-0 and brought class to boxing receive almost no respect?

I can see the Rock haters are already coming out. And 4 your info C it was a right cross that distorted Walcotts face. And Liston was and always will be a overrated bully that Ali exposed. And no fighter who ever fought him called him dirty. Find me proof and I will say I was wrong.

I ment Louis not Walcott. My father knew Rocky Marciano an 2 his dying breath he would tell me nobody would have stood in his way. End of story.

The questions simple, would he have more respect? Holmes? Holyfield? oh God its getting worse. Next someone will say Butterbean could beat the Rock. Wasnt Moore 48 when he fought Ali? Didnt Louis have his ''bum of the month club"? Holmes was good but fought guys who had 15 fights under their belt and a shot Ali. And Holyfield would be a war but like I stated, Rock was only down twice. And I got an idea lets build an alter to Sonny Liston and sacrifice virgins to him!!!!!!!!

And Doug C ur scaring me, u sound like doctor phil. Saw the photo, so u judge him by that? Walk a mile in a mans shoes grasshopper.

Im not looking for a pi$$ing contest dougie but what 2 crystal clear examples are u talking about? I ask a simple question and TROLLS like u ruin it and make it a fiasco. Why bother answering when ur a moron no it all? Or are u RACIST?????? DO U HATE WHITE ITALIANS????? u blast the rock whenever u can. Answer that mr. no it all.

Blogbaba, its only here in yahoo answers that I see HUGE resentment for the rock. Don Cockell was lucky to get a shot. The Rock fought and beat everyone in his way my question which now has turned into a Jerry Springer show was HAD he continued would he 1 move up peoples lists of all time greats and 2 would the people who say they know about boxing here in answers give him more respect. Everytime a question is posed about the Rock chaos takes over. AND TO DOUGIE, I have a library of fight films I would match against anyone and I have lived and breathed boxing since I could walk. So I think I know what im talking about .

Answer 1

He'd still be the undefeated heavyweight champion right now! Seriously, I think he would keep winning for four or five years and then start getting beat. Don't forget how good Rocky was in re-matches! Walcott 1st round KO and Charles fell in the 8th the second time around. Seems like after you've been in with Rocky, you ain't got much left. Charles is believed by many of the real experts to be the best Lt. Hvy. ever, and a damned good Heavyweight Champ to boot. Walcott BEAT a prime Joe Louis and was robbed of the decision. Ali was trained in Walcott's style by Angelo Dundee.

Answer 2

Rocky has plenty of respect. 49-0 is not something to disregard. His conditioning, will to win, endurance was exceptional, along with his power. However, boxing changes and so would the results. Fighter's get bigger, stronger and refs stop fights much quicker now. Even after Grittith/Peret, the rules of engagement changed. No ref would have allowed Rocky to endure some of the punishment he took. Marciano probably would have had a good chance against Johannson and Patterson, but Liston IMO was far better than given credit for because of his two Ali fights. Too much intangibels there. Even at the end of his career, Sonny put alot of hurt on people. Leotis Martin beat Liston, but never fought again, the result of a detatched retina and Wepner himself will list the injuries he incurred fighting an old Sonny Liston. Marciano, was good, not great and to think so is a big mistake IMO..Guys like Holmes, even Holyfield would have beaten Marciano.Foreman 1 0r 2 would have had a field day with the uppercut Ialone, IMO. Yes, Rocky had loads of respect, but not IMO the best of all time. Several would have either cut him up or gotten a stoppage somewhere along the way.

Answer 3

Ace, I disagree with the premise that Rocky Marciano gets almost no respect. Rocky gets plenty of respect from anyone who knows anything about heavyweight boxing. For a guy with 49 wins at heavyweight with a 67 inch reach to dominate his era, you have no choice, you have to respect him. Like or dislike who you want, some people's achievements in the ring demand respect. Ray Leonard may have beat Marvin Hagler with a style of boxing that some dislike, but everyone must respect Ray's accomplishment, like it or not. Floyd Mayweather may have the ability to force a fighter to chase him for 12 rounds and win boring decision's but you still must respect Floyd's talent. Marciano's walk around weight was 185, he was a small heavyweight my anyone's standard, and still defines toughness, and excuses aside Rocky beat some great champions in Charles, Moore, Walcott and Louis. Odds are very good both Patterson and Johanssen would have lost to Rocky, I would have favored Marciano over both had circumstances allowed that they met in the ring. Personally Liston might have came alone at a time when Rock was on the decline, and did to Marciano what Marciano did to Louis, but we will never know, because none of it ever happened.

I cannot understand how you can claim Rocky Marciano is somehow disrespected, I just don't see it. In circles I travel Marciano recieves the same respect any other "Great" heavyweight champion recieves. He is, and most likely will always remain a top ten all time great heavyweight champion, and that is just about the ultimate respect afforded a boxer. Differing opinions do not detract from Rock's stellar ring record, his legacy is impervious to our opinions.

Answer 4

Man this question gets beat like a dead horse.

Rock gets plenty of respect. He is rated high on all "best of" lists.

Sounds like what your really asking is why there isn't 100% consensus here. If you do not want to benefit from a diversity of opinion, then quit asking this kind of question.

Personally, I agree with Douglas C. Not because I dislike Rock, but because I perceive myself to be impartial when I view film on Rock and compare his quality of opposition with fighters rated as high. This should not be confused with me taking a shot at Rock.......he served well as champ, but the heavyweight division was not strong during his reign.

He could of fought 100 times without a defeat, and it would not have made a difference if he fought no one of significance or old ineffective legends.

I think your "perceived" notion that Rock is not respected is actually your own frustation caused by the fact that everyone here does not agree with you.

Some people have come to a logical / factual conclusion that Rock is overrated and people disagree with emotional outbursts that are not based in fact.

Do the research and judge as a boxing fan.......not a Marciano fan.

The fact that you do not acknowledge that Liston (who was powerful, younger, taller and 40 lbs bigger) would give a 37 year old Rock plenty of problems speaks to your inability to separate yourself as a Rock fan and use some rationale.

The consensus on all "best of" lists that I have seen rate Ali and a PRIME Louis higher than Rock. Yet you fail to grasp the concept that these two would have handed Rock a defeat.......check the facts.

While your at it.......find a fight with two fighters of equal skill sets, with one outweighing the other by 40 lbs, where the smaller guy beats the big guy.

Using your rationale....do you think that a prime Roberto Duran at 135 lbs can beat a prime Marvelous Hagler at 160 lbs? He rates higher than Hagler, so it must be true!!

Is Rock the only fighter in the history of boxing that can make a 40 lbs difference a non factor?

Where is the logic in your worship?

Answer 5

I love Rocky but he lost to Willie James December 14 1948 in an amateur bout in Philadelphia. Rocky lost 4 amateur fights. He is ranked #5 all time in most experts opinions

Answer 6

wow I never realized there was such resentment for the Rock I wish mr douggy c would some day meet a great champion and ask thier opinion of the Rock...... I am sure your opinion would change at the response you would recieve.... I know for a fact that Jazbac has met several of the greats when he attended Joe Louis' Funeral and I will defer to him. Boxing hisorian huh well LA DE DA

Answer 7

Rocky Marciano will never get the respect he deserves for one simple reason, unlike Ali he was not a great PR person. Rocky didn't care to sell his image, he was content for letting his actions in the ring speak for themselves. Also because he was smart enough to retire while he was still in his prime and not get beaten to a pulp and disabled or have their leagacy tarnished (see:Ali, see:Jones Jr.) alot of people chose to not give him the credit he deserves. NO MATTER WHO HE FOUGHT HE IS STILL THE ONLY HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMP TO EVER EVER EVER EVER FINISH WITH AN UNDEFEATED RECORD!!! NUFF SAID.

Answer 8

He would've lost to Patterson badly. He wouldn't have fought Liston, as his title reign would've been over by the time Liston hit it big. Basically, if Marciano were in any other era, he wouldn't be thought of as he is. He is thought of so highly because of his record, that is it. The best fighters he beat were past their prime natural LHW's and a way past his prime Joe Louis. In their primes Charles and Louis beat him.

Answer 9

The truth lies somewhere in between yahoo poster's asserions of "overrated" and "greatest heavyweight ever". I think he was a bit overrated and for reasons I've listed in detail on other threads. Not to seem egotistical, but nobody as of yet has been able to refute my arguments in this matter and I don't think it can be done. It's based on sound logic and reasoning, which I've used when assessing Rocky's career.

In answer to your question, if he had achieved those results you envision and went 55-0 then he would obviously be given even more credit than he does now. The problem is that he would have gotten hammered and brutally KO'd by that "overrated" Liston. He was bloodied and battered by old versions of Charles, Walcott and Moore(and they did it while SLUGGING! Which is supposed to be Rocky's fight!). So why not a bigger, stronger, more durable, harder punching and PRIME heavyweight like Sonny Liston?

BTW...many historians would disagree with your assessment of Rocky bringing "class" back to the sport. He was actually prone to being quite dirty(watch the Don Cockell fight). I have a great picture of Rocky contorting old Joe Louis' face with a beautifully placed elbow. Great he was, classy he was not. Unless you're talking about his behavior outside the ring.

ACEMAN- So anybody who disagrees with you on Marciano automatically qualifies as a "Rocky hater"?

Like I said, watch the Cockell fight. Elbows, headbutts...it's all there. The picture I spoke of is in The Big Book of Boxing by Harry Mullan. Rocky Marciano planting a nasty elbow right in poor old Joe's kisser. Have a look and get back to me.

JAZBAC- yes, I'm sure beating the crap out of people is more important to you than doing research and actually getting your facts straight. So much easier and requires less work(and even less thought).

Check out Bluedevil's resolved question "Do you think Rocky Marciano will ever really be appreciated for his perfect record as he should?" for my in depth answer on this matter. If you can come up with a cogent response I would like to hear it. Judging by your childish tirade I won't need to hold my breath.

And BTW...among other things, your credibility takes quite a nosedive when you say things like "Charles was exactly in his prime!" Ridiculous to any boxing historian. He was in his 14th year(91 fights) and starting to get beaten regularly by the top heavyweights BEFORE he faced Rocky. Hardly his prime.

ACE- "Find me proof and I will say that I was wrong"(your words). I find you two crystal clear examples and instead of admitting you were wrong you start with the apologist act. Beautiful. Like Jazbac, your esteem for Marciano is more based on "feelings" than facts. Like I said, anyone who disagrees with you on RM is automatically a "Rocky hater" in your book. But the facts are stubborn, amigo, and they won't go away no matter how much you cherish your Marciano memories and despise anyone who challenges them.

ACE- You resort to childish name-calling, which tells me I made my point. "Give me examples and I'll admit I'm wrong" I GAVE you the examples already. The Cockell fight and Louis pic are just the most flagrant so I used them as an example. I'm not going through my collection of Marciano fights(something every Marciano hater owns, right?) and pointing out every instance of dirty fighting to you(and there's plenty). Do your own research. Or is that asking too much?

The funny thing is, I never considered Rocky dirty, just rough. I was merely pointing out that many historians think he was dirty(especially the British) and would disagree with you saying he brought class to the sport.

And by the way, a better question would be why do you post questions when all you're looking for is people to agree with you in your Marciano-worship? You weren't looking for answers, just people who see things your way.

If you think I hate RM then you haven't read my past posts. And please don't even try to intimidate me by playing the race card.

Answer 10

marciano would have kept winning. he would have beat both patterson and johanson. also nino valdez, eddie machan, tommy "huricane" jackson etc. he would have lost badly to sonny liston to end his undefeated reign. by the time he fought liston the wars would take it toll on him. the rock in his prime would beat liston