Moral behavior, or humane behavior?

Question

When my son was in the last week of his life, and in extreme pain, he had one nurse who was very religious and quite judgemental.
She refused to follow doc's orders for pain med. When I complained, she said, "I might put him into a coma he can't come back from. Is THAT what you want?" And I said "So be it. Stop the pain"

She refused, because "Some day I will have to face My God. He will judge me if I kill this man."

Do you think she was morally right in this stance? Is this what you, as a Christian would do with a terminally ill patient? (She reported me to the doctor. "This Mom wants me to kill her son for her.")

Mikael, we were in the US, and he had a written order for pain med. Another nurse told me that he did not have an order for a lethal amount. Giving the dose as written would have relieved pain, maybe made him feel drowsy.
I told the head nurse, & she called in the pharmacist in charge of pain mgmnt. He yelled at the nurse, made her turn up the pain meter. I did not have strength enough to report her to administrator.


Another nurse said she'd heard this nurse tell the doctor I'd wanted her to kill my son. Dr told her "I will not listen to YOUR bullsh**.

When he died, all other nurses came to hug us and comfort us. I was not able to cry at that moment. Not wanting to "let go" because maybe I couldn't function, if I did. But that nurse stood at the nurses' station and glared at me. I suppose she thought I was a cold hearted Mom because I didn't cry.

Answer 1

Kiwi.
My sincerest condolences on your tragic loss, particularly given the circumstances.
Where the pain and suffering of another person is concerned no-one has a 'moral' right to decide the rights and wrongs of pain medication.
Basing any decision on religious grounds is at best questionable. To quote "When I face my God" leaves me wondering at the mental state of this person. I believe Osama Bin Liner uses 'God' as a justification for his actions.
My best wishes to you in this sad time.

Answer 2

I totally agree with sybil_the_soothsayer. I am a qualified nurse & have given many people their last pain injections. I see it as helping them survive their last bit of time in comfort & dignity. Why should anyone have to suffer pain these days, whether dying or not? No relative wants to see their loved ones suffer through lack of pain relief - what an unnecessary nightmare memory to have to live with!

If that nurse can't do her job, then maybe she's in the wrong profession. The patient should always come first, then the relative, not the nurse / doctor. After all, we're all here to do the best we can for our patients.

As for reporting you, I would make a formal complaint about her - seriously I would!! If a nurse in my charge made such a complaint about a relative, I would automatically ask that relative for a response. Did you get asked?

Answer 3

A nurse who violate legitimate Doctor's orders can be disciplined. Now, if the orders aren't specific, such as THE PATIENT MUST BE RE-MEDICATED QID, then she has the option to interpret them

If the orders are THE PATIENT CAN BE RE-MEDICATED QID IF CONDITIONS SO WARRANT then it is open ended and she can make the decision.

It becomes a your opinioin vs her opinion thing

When I had surgery my Doctor left a medication order through the next day. They asked if I wanted it and I said no. The surgery no longer hurt, but I had cramps due to the medicatioin stoping my system.

They offered me the Demoral and I asked the Nurse if that would keep the condition of cramping or even make it worse and she agree with me it might be better to endure the pain than continue to stop the body from functioning normally.

Answer 4

It isn't for her to decide. All medical decisions of such impact must be authorised by the doctor and the patient (or next of kin). And frankly if she thought that pain relief was tantamount to murder what on earth was she doing being a nurse??
You weren't talking about killing anyone, just deciding how the last hard part of his life should be lived. Pain relief doesn't kill people, but it could take them to dreams where pain is not an issue.
I really think she was a bit unhinged and I would make a complaint about her not following doctors instructions.

Answer 5

The thing with your question is:

First you have to take into account the country where you are living, or were living at the time of the event?

You were grieving and probably still are, and no one wants to see a loved one suffering.

I many places in the world euthanasia or assisted suicide is VERY illegal. And no one will assist you on that independently of their morals.

As for the nurse she should not be a nurse..... a nurse has no right to input their own moral in patients, independently of the patients state and consciousness. I work in a UK hospital and nurses are not legally allowed to have a view, if their view will affect the patients will, or even the doctors requests.

My personal oppinion as a christian is that people should have the right to decide whether they live or die. As for myself, I am going to make a will, in the eventuality of me having an accident I don't want any life support machines nor my life porlonged my artificial mechanisms. But doctors may not take my will in consideration as the law may make them responsible for my death. Unfortunately we live in a society of dependence, and where very ill near death people are made to suffer and live not for their sake but for their selfish relatives and societies pleasure.

Answer 6

I don't think it's a call on 'moral' or 'humane' behaviour.

I think the nurse is way out of line - it's *not* within her job jurisdiction to decide on matters like that - it's between you and the doctor on the level of pain medication to be administered. The nurse is to assist, that's all.

Pain management is an essential medical tool, and the doctor is the one who is really medically qualified to judge how much is adequate or not.

Did you check with the doctor on the final word on this?

I am sorry to hear about your/your son's situation and your son's passing away.

Answer 7

First of all this was a very sad thing for me to read.

I am so sorry for your loss and hope you find some consolation.

as for the question, this was your son. The nurse should have realized that and realized that making a person comfortable is her job.

Telling you what youre gonna face in the hereafter was NOT her job.

It doesnt matter what we personally feel sometimes,
that we remember to be considerate of other peoples needs is a lot more important. And knowing our duties is ofcourse more important.

Answer 8

No, I do not think she was morally right in her stance. I would have reported her right back for failure to obey the doc's orders and depriving your child of pain relief.

These people who get on a high horse about pain meds have probably never been in real pain themselves. Opiate painkillers occur in nature; what does she think God put them here for?

Answer 9

She was completely and totally self absorbed and WRONG. When I was a nurse, I know I gave many a dying patient their last pain shot. I didn't kill anyone. I relieved their pain. That woman was monstrous.

Answer 10

If she's unable to do her job (follow medication instructions from a physician) because of her religious beliefs, she should have been put in a position where she didn't have to choose between doing the 'right' thing and doing her job.