How do Roman Catholics reconcile their practice of praying "through" Mary & saints with 1 Timothy 2:5...

Question

Thanks in advance for all answers !

David B -

With all due respect, that's not true.

What is praying but speaking to and / or asking something of someone ?

Sentinel -

I have no objection to LIVING Christians praying FOR ME. That is CLEARLY (?) not the same as praying to God through DEAD ONES.

Communication with the dead is the practice of spiritualism, which the Bible, God's word, categorically forbids.

Incidentally, the general evangelical (and biblical) definition of the term "saints" differs greatly from the Roman misconception.

Evangelical Christians generally understand "saints" to refer to ALL blood-bought, saved-by-grace-through-faith, born-again, believers in God through Jesus Christ. On occasion, English translations of the Bible also use this term to refer to angelic beings.

The erroneous RC application of the term "saint" is used -please correct me if I'm wrong- in regard to dead "Catholics" venerated & allegedly communicated with by those connected to the Roman church. Totally unbiblical.

Again, please feel free to correct me, but I don't believe that you will find a single scripture which positively, explicitly condones such a spiritualistic practice. Pure superstitious paganism...

David B -

Hi.

The Bible, God's word, says, "For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God." (Romans 8:14).

NOWHERE in the Bible does it say that we are to receive guidance from dead "saints". Please feel free to quote a scripture if you can prove otherwise, friend.

Do you believe the Bible is God's word ? It says that through faith in Christ you can come directly to the Father (God).

"For you have not received a spirit of slavery bringing you into fear again, but you have received a spirit of SONSHIP in which we cry, Abba, Father !" (Romans 8:15, caps for emphasis).

You can only receive that spirit of sonship by being born-again -transformed from within - through faith in Jesus Christ, His death & resurrection, and not through the guilt-ridden bondage of the Roman Catholic salvation-by-works religious system.

May God bless you, David.

Answer 1

Catholics argue that praying to Mary and the saints is no different than asking someone here on earth to pray for you. Let us examine that claim. (1) The Apostle Paul asks other Christians to pray for him in Ephesians 6:19. Many Scriptures describe believers praying for one another (2 Corinthians 1:11; Ephesians 1:16; Philippians 1:19; 2 Timothy 1:3). The Bible nowhere mentions anyone asking for someone in Heaven to pray for them. The Bible nowhere describes anyone in Heaven praying for anyone on earth. (2) The Bible gives absolutely no indication that Mary or the saints can hear our prayers. Mary and the saints are not omniscient. Even glorified in Heaven, they are still finite beings with limitations. How could they possibly hear the prayers of millions of people? Whenever the Bible mentions praying to or speaking with the dead, it is in the context of sorcery, witchcraft, necromancy, and divination - activities the Bible strongly condemns (Leviticus 20:27; Deuteronomy 18:10-13). The one instance when a "saint" is spoken to, Samuel in 1 Samuel 28:7-19, Samuel was not exactly happy to be disturbed. It is plainly clear that praying to Mary or the saints is completely different from asking someone here on earth to pray for you. One has a strong Biblical basis, the other has no Biblical basis whatsoever.

God does not answer prayers based on who is praying. God answers prayers based on whether they are asked according to His will (1 John 5:14-15). There is absolutely no basis or need to pray to anyone other than God alone. There is no basis for asking those who are in Heaven to pray for us. Only God can hear our prayers. Only God can answer our prayers. No one in Heaven has any greater access to God's throne that we do through prayer (Hebrews 4:16).

Recommended Resource: The Gospel According to Rome: Comparing Catholic Tradition and The Word of God by James McCarthy.

Answer 2

<> And we Catholics agree. The problem is your interpretation of scripture. You assume you are right in what you have interpreted and Catholics rely on the original Apostolic interpretation that has been consistent and unchanged for 2000 years. An individual interpretation is subject to individual bias, experience, and culture. The Church interpretation is timeless. It comes from God, through his Apostles, passed on to his Church. Most often what happens is non-Catholics read the Bible, they interpret it and decide the Catholic Church is wrong, because the Catholic Church does not appear to follow the Bible based on that individuals interpretation. The problem is you have no way of knowing, or supporting your interpretation. You only have you, and your assumptions. The Church has Sacred Tradition, Sacred Scripture and the writings of the Early Christians, all of which give consistent support to the Church teachings and current application of those teachings.

Answer 3

the problem is you have selected one verse from the bible to make your point, whereas catholics use it all in context. i could pick and choose verses to support the catholic opinion but you will still reject it(it seems from your additional comments that you are trying to make a point as opposed to trying to understand our position). if you are interested here are some sites that may help you on this and other problems you have with the church that gave and made possible for you to have a bible.

www.scripturecatholic.com
www.askmeaboutgod.com
www.catholiceducation.org
www.newadvetn.org
www.fisheaters.com
www.ewtn.com

all the sources teach in accordance with the catholioc book known as the bible. see also a catechism and the writings of the early church fathers. you may not agree with it all but it will answer your questions.

Answer 4

Another charge commonly levelled against asking the saints for their intercession is that this violates the sole mediatorship of Christ, which Paul discusses: "For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus" (1 Tim. 2:5).

But asking one person to pray for you in no way violates Christ’s mediatorship, as can be seen from considering the way in which Christ is a mediator. First, Christ is a unique mediator between man and God because he is the only person who is both God and man. He is the only bridge between the two, the only God-man. But that role as mediator is not compromised in the least by the fact that others intercede for us. Furthermore, Christ is a unique mediator between God and man because he is the Mediator of the New Covenant (Heb. 9:15, 12:24), just as Moses was the mediator (Greek mesitas) of the Old Covenant (Gal. 3:19–20).

The intercession of fellow Christians—which is what the saints in heaven are—also clearly does not interfere with Christ’s unique mediatorship because in the four verses immediately preceding 1 Timothy 2:5, Paul says that Christians should interceed: "First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life, godly and respectful in every way. This is good, and pleasing to God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth" (1 Tim. 2:1–4). Clearly, then, intercessory prayers offered by Christians on behalf of others is something "good and pleasing to God," not something infringing on Christ’s role as mediator.

Answer 5

We ask Mary and the saints to pray for us as any Christian will ask another to pray for him or her. We believe that all in Heaven are alive as Jesus promised. He promised that we will have eternal life.

We believe that Mary is a co-mediatrix with Jesus. This is "co" as in co-pilot. A co-pilot does not pilot the plane but assists the pilot in piloting the plane. Mary gains this distinction because she gave Jesus His human form, His body. As we know now, every human is composed genetically by one-half from each parent. Jesus is one-half genetically the same as Mary.

Jesus is the mediator with God. Only He alone, in His humanity and Godhead can mediate our way into God's presence. Mary assists the mediation. The Saints pray for us as the saints on Earth pray for us.

Hope this helps you. It helped me.

Yours in Christ Jesus, Grace (a Protestant convert)

Answer 6

As Evan said, Roman Catholics are not praying to or through Mary and the Saints.

A good example is the words to the "Hail Mary". The actual "prayer" part is, "Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us sinners". You're basically asking Mary to pray to God on your behalf.

Answer 7

You can pray to anyone you want. There are some people who even pray to their ancestors.

Don't take First Timothy 2:5 so freakin literal. Lighten up. Life is good.

I'm not a Catholic, but I hear a lot of criticism of Catholics. Why not criticize the Baptists for a change? They got some really weird doctrines if you care to take a look.

Answer 8

Roman Catholics do not pray to or through Mary or saints, They are asked for Guidance in tough times.


EDIT:
Well it was for me in Ireland. You pray to god and ask for guidance of saints. they are two different things. Saying it isn't true is Wrong unless you also grew up in Howth, Dublin and Were my priest.

Answer 9

Thanks for asking that. I wonder that myself. God Bless.
They use 1 Tim. 2:1 as an answer, but this is referring to live people praying for other people, I don't see anything in there about praying to dead saints! And what about Mary? They pray directly to her, as if she is a goddess. I don't believe the Mary they pray to is Jesus' mother (not that that makes it rght) but, Mary, Queen of Heaven. The mother/child cult of the Bible. I think many are deceived by this, especially those worshipping in the Catholic faith.
For those who are talking about angels interceding, ANGELS ARE NOT SAINTS, OR DEAD HUMANS. They are servants of God, created especially for that purpose. They do have access to heaven and earth. Dead people don't! The saints in Revelation are the saints who are worshipping in heaven in the future, when we will be in heaven, also.They are redeemed men. We are all saints who follow the Lord Jesus Christ. Saints are here on earth as well. And, it is not up to any church to grant anyone sainthood. That is God's Job!!! I think if the dead saints could see that they are being prayed to, they would be horrified by it. I know I would. Jesus said "Leave the dead to the dead." You cannot communicate with the dead. No one has been raptured yet. Their souls are in heaven or hell, but we cannot communicate with them. It doesn't say anywhere in the Bible about Mary being a mediator, and helping with any prayers. We pray to God, the Father, THROUGH JESUS, HIS SON. There is no need for any mediator in heaven besides Him! Jesus TORE DOWN THE CURTAIN IN THE TEMPLE. We can pray for each other, for sure, that's what it means. Pray for each other.

Answer 10

Fundamentalists challenge the Catholic practice of asking saints and angels to pray for us. But the Bible directs us to invoke those in heaven and ask them to pray with us.

Thus in Psalm 103, we pray, "Bless the Lord, O you his angels, you mighty ones who do his word, hearkening to the voice of his word! Bless the Lord, all his hosts, his ministers that do his will!" (Ps. 103:20-21). And in Psalm 148 we pray, "Praise the Lord! Praise the Lord from the heavens, praise him in the heights! Praise him, all his angels, praise him, all his host!" (Ps. 148:1-2)

Not only do those in heaven pray with us, they also pray for us. In Revelation, John sees that "the twenty-four elders [the leaders of the people of God in heaven] fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints" (Rev. 5:8). Thus the saints in heaven offer to God the prayers of the saints on earth.

Angels do the same thing: "[An] angel came and stood at the altar [in heaven] with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne; and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God" (Rev. 8:3-4).

Jesus himself warned us not to mess with small children because their guardian angels have guaranteed intercessory access to the Father: "See that you do not despise one of these little ones; for I tell you that in heaven their angels always see the face of my Father who is in heaven." (Matt. 18:10).

Because he is the only God-man, Jesus is the only Mediator between man and God (1 Tim. 2:5), but this in no way means we cannot or should not ask our fellow Christians to pray with us and for us (1 Tim. 2:1-4), including those Christians in heaven, who have already had their sanctification completed, for [the prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects" (James. 5:16).