Christians and atheists cannot agree because reality is more complex than a simple dichotomy can describe.?

Question

Assuming God must either exist or not exist creates a paradox which cannot be answered. This is because humanity has literally changed the definition of reality in the last 350 years. The philosophy of Plato and Aristotle (about 400 BC) defined reality as idealistic and solipsistic, meaning that subjective experience was considered absolutely real and objective reality was considered an illusion created by our minds. Based on this philosopby, St. Augustine (about 390) invented the concept of the soul to explain how both conscious awareness and Christ's promise of eternal life was possible. Educated western civilization universally accepted this view until science began to discover, beginning with Gallileo (about 1590) that the physical realm is actually real and subjective experience is an illusion created by our living brains. This means that God actually does exist in subjective experience and simultaneously that He does not exist in objective reality. Is compromise possible?

Answer 1

Well if god truly existed then compromise would not be possible because of the discription we give to god. If god did not exist in objective reality, than there is no god. Subjective experience is according to the 'subject' and there is no god there if truly god is for everyone. Either god exists in objective experience or not at all. However, you have taken the assumption that god does not exist in objective reality? Perhaps god has to be given a new description for surely god exists, otherwize we lack the foundations for our existence and justification.
I speak from a 16 y/o pagans point of view!

Answer 2

I am quite confident that the universe exists, and would continue to exist along with all its laws, whether we did or did not. There is no objective/subjective reality. There is simply reality, which contains many things known and unknown, many things comprehensible and incomprehensible, and our willingness or unwillingness to accept the evidence we discover determines how we perceive reality.

At this time there is no evidence for god, there are simply many unknown and incomprehensible aspects to reality that we ascribe to a concept we call god. We do this because it "feels" better to our limited human minds. This is the compromise average people make.

This, however, is not evidence, therefore it is an irrational perception, and the minority of people we label atheists accept this, and refuse to compromise.

So the answer is no. Compromise is not possible until average humans learn to think beyond conventional (comfortable) explanations for reality.

Answer 3

Actually, no, Aristotle was an empiricist. Plato was a Dualist. The Epicureans speculated that ultimate reality was purely natural, and St Augustine speculated that the soul existed in physical form and that sin was passed down through sperm.

John Locke and Francis Bacon, not Galileo, returned to the Epicurean model of empiricism.

I'm not sure what compromise you're asking for.

Answer 4

It may be that reality is very complex. On the other hand, I find it unlikely that this or that myth actually adds any understanding to anything other than anthropology, or at best, psychology.

In the first place, it's quite tendentious to pose it as a question of Christians vs. atheists. Christians are just one of a many supernatural tendencies in historical monotheism. And then there are the myriad of polytheistic and non-theistic (but metaphysical) traditions.

Secondly, the chances of a religious person accepting that their god is not part of "objective reality" are slim to zilch.

Answer 5

Well, the objective reality is that there is no god.

It's simply false that "assuming God must either exist or not exist creats a paradox". It does no such thing. Either God exists or does not exist, and vaguely worded new age crap doesn't change that fact.

Pretty much all of what you've written there asserts falsely that there is no objective reality, without making any argument supporting that assertion. The assertion is false.

I went through that "there is no reality" phase back in the 1980s, before I studied philosophy in graduate school. I've outgrown it.

Answer 6

Reality is reality, independent of what any human believes. There is no paradox; only disagreement over what the objective reality is.

@Julia - Atheism does not hold that reality happened by accident. It is simply the absence of belief in gods--no more, no less.

And despite popular belief (and misrepresentation by creationists), science does not hold that reality happened by accident either. Science has *theories* to explain how things happen. To say that it was all an accident is to say that there's no theory.

Answer 7

No compromise. Sorry.

I agree God only exists in the subjective experience, though.

"the physical realm is actually real"

thin ground, there. If you start to examine the physical realm and get down to the really small scale (Quantum) things start to look weird again.

Answer 8

i'm a Christian, and a youthful earth creationist, and that i agree. yet this is the situation. technology can not initiate with the assumption of a God, or the assumption of introduction. It starts with not something, and strikes with the aid of concepts in keeping with information. technology can see the organic, and makes use of the organic to teach that this is organic. The introduction of the universe became a supernatural adventure. technology can not trust that as an appropriate commencing up, because of the fact that is not organic. The beginning of species, and of the universe as regarded at by utilizing evolutionists is the final they are able to do, with out looking previous their own expertise. with out giving the introduction form even of challenge, how could they ever come to that end? God created the Universe and each little thing in it. God's techniques are above guy's techniques.

Answer 9

Reality does not change only humans interpretation of it. As instruments become more precise so our view of reality becomes clearer. However nowhere in the universe is their room or need for a made up invisible creature. Unless you are delusional. In which case reality has no meaning for you.

Answer 10

I doubt you're going to have many on either side agreeing with your premises.

Personally I think that compromise is not possible because Believers have unquestioned assumptions regarding the existence of God, and atheists await any verifiable evidence. Because of these stance differences, there is no compromise available until Believers are willing to admit the possibility that their assumption may be wrong.

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