Why do some people take the 144,000 as literal but the Jewish, males who are celebate as figurative?

Question

wouldn't it make some sense to consider the possibility that it could be all figurative or all literal
approaching the scriptures to get truth out of it rather than impose a preference as you read it

from chapter 7

9After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. 10And they cried out in a loud voice:
"Salvation belongs to our God,
who sits on the throne,
and to the Lamb." 11All the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures. They fell down on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, 12saying:
"Amen!
Praise and glory
and wisdom and thanks and honor
and power and strength
be to our God for ever and ever.
Amen!"

from chapter 14
(note 'not defiled with women' they were portrayed as men)

1Then I looked, and there before me was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads. 2And I heard a sound from heaven like the roar of rushing waters and like a loud peal of thunder. The sound I heard was like that of harpists playing their harps. 3And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth. 4These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb. 5No lie was found in their mouths; they are blameless.

I think most people would say the Bible is true in the sense claimed... I guess the question is ... in what sense is it claimed.... and perhaps give the most weight to the plainest clearest explained and more repeated things

perhaps celebate isn't the right word 'not defiled by women' can probably mean a variety of things... but it sounds like men to me

Answer 1

you hit the nail on the head at the end of your question

people pull out of it whatever suits them

Answer 2

You're so rigtht! I get so annoyed with people who say it's christians, and not messianic jews. So silly. If being from the particular tribes, and being celebate wasn't important, it wouldn't have been mentioned in the first place. The JW's have it really mixed up, I don't know if reading comprehension is the problem or what. Many people try to change the word to fit their own desires.

Sorry, Todd, its does say celebate males:

Revelation 14.
2 And I heard a sound from heaven like the roar of rushing waters and like a loud peal of thunder. The sound I heard was like that of harpists playing their harps. 3 And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth. 4 These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb. 5 No lie was found in their mouths; they are blameless.

Answer 3

I'm not familiar with the passage about celibate jewish males, but the 144,000 is a very literal prophecy that I have no reason to believe will not be literally fulfilled. It is one of my favourite parts of the bible.

I think the Bible is it's own best interpreter and though there are some figurative or symbolic passages that require some explanation, 99% of the biblical text should simply be read literally as you would normally read any book. Those passages that are not strictly literal always refer to other passages in the bible that give you the context to correctly understand the meaning.

Answer 4

To consider whether the number is literal or figurative can be seen in the right sense when you consider Revelation 7:9.
Here it speaks about a great crowd that no one could number? This being a figurative expression then its only logical That 144,000 is a definite number.


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Answer 5

Golden rule of interpretation: if the most literal sense makes sense, seek no other sense.

It is quite clear who the 144,000 are. Jewish men from the 12 tribes of Israel, just exactly as the bible tells us.

That's why it's so bizarre how the JW's (and others) seem to have this so mixed up.

Answer 6

then why people never explain why in Revelation 14:1-5 says that they are from all the earth not only Jews, and the only one the bible says are redeem from earth, the bible doesn´t say that the great crownd are redeem from earth, they will stay in earth as Jesus said in Matthew 5:5.

Answer 7

The number is figurative concerning the 12 tribes.

Answer 8

Because Joseph Rutherford had to hold onto the concept of a "special" small "class" of people to run the religion he spawned from the committee that C.T. Russell had designated to run his religious publishing house. He kept as "literal" that which fit into his plans. The word your looking for to describe his reasoning is "specious."

Answer 9

Revelation 7
4 Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel.
5 From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed,
from the tribe of Reuben 12,000,
from the tribe of Gad 12,000,
6 from the tribe of Asher 12,000,
from the tribe of Naphtali 12,000,
from the tribe of Manasseh 12,000,
7 from the tribe of Simeon 12,000,
from the tribe of Levi 12,000,
from the tribe of Issachar 12,000,
8 from the tribe of Zebulun 12,000,
from the tribe of Joseph 12,000,
from the tribe of Benjamin 12,000.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=73&chapter=7&version=31

No where in there does it say males OR celebate. Interestingly enough the last count I heard of messianic Jews was actually pretty close to that.......

Answer 10

Maybe they know something the literals regarding this don't. There will not be 144 thousands. It is representative; And I am not a physical Jew. I am a spiritual Jew.

Answer 11

I take it as it is stated in the Bible, Literal.