Homosexuality--should Christians care?

Question

I think Christians selectively choose Bible verses to back up their secular hatred of gays. They don't like homosexuality, so they try to find an excuse that supports their view in the Bible.

Everyone quotes the Old Testament when it comes to gays, but the Old Testament famously calls for "an eye for an eye" while Jesus called for "turning the other cheek." Shouldn't followers of Christ be going with HIS teachings when there are conflicts between the two texts? (The Old Testament also said it was OK to keep slaves, remember.)

Luke 17:34 in one translation of the Bible says "Jesus claims, 'I tell you; on that night two PEOPLE will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left.'" But in another translation, it says 'I tell you, in that night there shall be two MEN in one bed...' Who made that substitution? An EDITOR decides what Christians believe?

Jesus may not have even mentioned gays. Are there ANY Christians eager to leave this prejudice behind in the Old Testament?

Part of my point of showing two different versions of the Bible was how much PEOPLE, HUMANS, NOT GOD play a role in choosing what the Bible says. The idea that this holy text is some fixed thing is false. I see the Old Testament as full of God's wrath, and the New Testament full of God's growing understanding and compassion for humanity that he experiences through his son.

LOL!!! I knew it was only a matter of time before someone brought up having sex with animals. Consensual sex between adults is not the same as RAPING a dog. Duh.

Check out Hey,Ray -- he thinks that slaves were servants who "willingly gave up their freedom." I guess if the alternative was poverty, starvation, disease and death, that's what you'd willingly do--but the educated among us call that a Hobson's choice.

Answer 1

There is no hate. Both old and new says its wrong. Christians really shouldn't care any more about homosexuality than any other sin. I don't. It is a popular topic to talk to Christians about and I answer whoever asks, so it may appear that we care most about this issue when that is just not the case!

Homosexuality has never been condoned by God. There has never been any question about God's feeling on the matter. It is described as an abomination and uncleanness in the old and new testaments.

Lev 18:22You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination.

1 Kings 14:24And there were also perverted persons[1] in the land. They did according to all the abominations of the nations which the LORD had cast out before the children of Israel.
Footnotes
1. 14:24 Hebrew qadesh, that is, one practicing sodomy and prostitution in religious rituals

Leviticus 20:13If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them.

Romans 1:24Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, 25who exchanged
the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. 26For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due. 32who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

1 Cor 6:9Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals,[1] nor sodomites, 10nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
Footnotes
1. 6:9 That is, catamites

New Testament and fornication, abominations and uncleanness. Should Christians engage in this? No.

Gal 5:3But fornication and all uncleanness or covetousness, let it not even be named among you, as is fitting for saints; 4neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks. 5For this you know,[1] that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man,who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. 6Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience. 7Therefore do not be partakers with them.

19Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery,[3] fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21envy, murders,[4] drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

1 Thes 4:7For God did not call us to uncleanness, but in holiness.

Col 3:5Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 6Because of these things the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience,

1 Cor 7:1 Now concerning the things of which you wrote to me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. 2Nevertheless, because of sexual immorality, let
each man have his own wife, and let each woman have her own husband.

Homosexuality did exist then, but you see it is not listed here for a reason.

This was the way God intended:

Gen 1:27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.

Gen 2:24 Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.

Answer 2

First let me clear up one thing. The Old Testament or Covenant and the New do not contradict each other at any point. If anything the New is stricter than the old. Even the New testament speaks out against gays. I Timothy 1. The things that were wrong in the Old are just as wrong in the New. It is not a predjudice, homosexuality is a sin and a destructive use of ones body.

Even in Jesus's time the eye for an eye was very prevelent. Jesus was not refuting that idea, he was just setting a higher standard.

On the translation kick. There can be many diffrent ways to interperet a certain line from the Bible. First there is the language. The Old was written in Hebrew. That is fairly straightforward, except we do not have words with exactly the same meaning as the words in Hebrew. So there is a judgement call made, and they use the closest equivalent. The New was written in Greek or Aramaic.
The next point is the culture of the time. If you said today that two men were in a bed, it would be seen as they are gay. In those times it wasn't unusual for three or four men to share a bed. Eufamisms are also diffrent between cultures. In bed in our culture refers to sex. Then it did not.
By the way, Jesus never spoke out against slave holding. In the context of the Old, a slave is not what modern day people would have considered a slave. Slavery of the time was more of indentured servitude for a given period of time, either to pay off a debt or to pay for a crime. The slave was not a piece of property.
Just because a sin is accepted by the general populus it doesn't make it any less of a sin.

Answer 3

People is the correct translation. Or two of mankind. In the Greek, the _word_ men is omitted altogether so that it would read: "on that night two will be in one bed."

The OT teaching of "eye for an eye" was not that if you damaged my eye I was _required_ to retaliate, but that if you damaged my eye, I was not allowed to require more than that from you. In other words, I could not demand your life be taken because you hurt my eye. Slaves are also still around in the NT - though I agree it's emphasis is different.

Here's the thing. I don't hate gays. I hate people bashing gays - or anyone else for that matter. I'm not looking for verses to support hatred, but there are some verses that cause me some concern. Verses that keep me from being able to support homosexuality as a lifestyle.

And they're not all in the OT. Romans 1:26-27: For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.

Jesus didn't teach about homosexuality because it would have been cause for the death penalty among the Jews. Jesus was a Jew, and taught almost exclusively to the Jews. Homosexuality was used in idolaltry, and by Jesus' time, the Jews had left idolatry. For that reason, homosexuality wouldn't have been something Jesus taught about.

So my problem is that I cannot in good conscience see that it's okay to tell people that homosexuality is not something God condemns when it seems to me that He does condemn it. That doesn't mean that I hate gays. I worry about their spiritual state.

In the end, it is between them and God. It's not my place to judge them. But if asked about my understanding about what the scriptures say on the matter, I also can't lie about that.

Answer 4

The Old Testament and New Testament are the word of God that endures forever. The truth is the truth it does not change.
The Bible says an eye for an eye and it is indeed God's righteousness. Jesus did teach to turn the other cheek and it must surely be true.Do these teachings contradict? The Old Testament does teach an eye for an eye it also teaches that vengence belongs ot God. Jesus taught that God's law is righteous and that he without sin should cast the first stone.
These teachings do not contradict. God is indeed righteous and man is not man is in need of a savior and he did fufill the law. We are by faith changed to God's righteousness and no longer serve sin. It does not mean the law has passed away but that we are by faith made in agreement with the law and God's righteousness.

Answer 5

I don't hate gays I hate the sin that's in there life. I'm a christian and I sin everyday we all do we are not perfect. But I don't practice sin and when you are in a homosexual relationship you are practicing sin. Now since you want to compare the old and new testament, why don't you get out your bible and read 1 Corinthians (which is in the new testament by the way) Chapter 6 verses 9-11. It's a sin just like stealing, of gossiping, or having hatred, masturbation and a million others and if you are caught in it you will go to HELL. I don't care who wrote the bible or how many times it has been tranlated Jesus said that he would send the Holy Spirit which will be your teacher among others things. I don't care what people say I don't care what doctors or psychiatrist say you are not born that way it is a spirit just like every other kind of sin and if you don't accept Jesus into your life as your Lord and Savior and get delivered when judgment days comes and you go before Jesus He is gonna say "DEPART FROM ME, YOU WORKER OF INIQUITY I NEVER KNEW YOU"

Answer 6

Yes there are different translations to the Bible but they are for easier understanding. If you look at the New American Standard Updated, it is the most accurate word for word translation from the original Texts. 1 Corinthians 6:9, 1 Timothy 1:10 also speak against Homosexuality.

Here is the kicker we are to love the people but hate the sin. Sin is what separates people from God and we should feel for those people because it is what is separating them from God. But we should love them just like Jesus loved them.

Jesus hung out with sinners all the time. If feel uncomfortable around a certain type of people...because we are all human...just do not hang around them.

The sad thing is that because a few morons that slap a big label on them-self saying "look at me, I'm a Christian," That ruins it for the ones who are true and sincere about loving others and wanting to help them find answers in this journey of life.

Answer 7

No. People aren't to stand in judgment of homosexuality or anything else. That is the sole right of God.

Regarding the selective choice of Bible verses to back up any kind of hatred -- it may well be a practice of some to do this. The Bible is very specific in it's condemnation of homosexuality if you take it back to the original translations in context.

The 'eye for an eye' codex was actually originated by Hammurabi, the sixth king of Babylon and is referenced in the New Testament , Matthew 5:38 - "You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' This is a specific reference to the codex of Hammurabi.

Luke 17:34 involves a subject mentioned in verse 30 "Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed." and refers to the fact that one in the field will be left and one will be taken; the two in bed likewise where one will be left and one will be taken.

In the era contemporary to the writing of the original manuscripts people slept on 'beds' we would call pallets and it was common to share sleeping areas of this type.

Likewise, often the male gender was used as a figure of speech to apply to all people and is not gender specific in that context. However "Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left." is a gender specific reference relative to the duties performed.

Those who are "left" are at the seventh seal, the seventh vial, and the seventh trump. Those who are "taken" were deceived by the antichrist at the sixth seal, the sixth vial, and the sixth trump.

I agree with your contention that Jesus never condemned gays. Christ was the advocate of the sinner and sought to forgive. However he also stated that he did not come to change 'one jot or tiddle of the law' and homosexuality was a violation of both Levitical law and Hebrew canon.

This prejudice for gays as you call it cannot be ignored because it contradicts the word of God and He finds it an abomination.

The Old Testament remains just as much the Word of God as the New Testament.

Answer 8

Why would you wish to paint such a bigoted picture of Christians? There is only a small percentage of Christians who are homophobic.

The sad fact is - these days when anti-Christianity is the last acceptable bigotry, the minute someone opens their mouth and says something homophobic it is automatically ASSUMED that they are Christian.

I am not such a Christian. In fact, I don't know of anyone who IS such a Christian. I have many friends who are gay. I adore them.

I've seen a handful of hateful television evangelicals. They are a very small percentage. And yet they make a lot of noise.

The whole "squeaky wheel" thing.

They are equally hateful to other issues unlike themselves. Race. Other denominations of Christianity. Other religions.

We are not all like that. In fact, very few of us are.

Answer 9

Real Christians don't hold prejudice and hatred for anyone. That's what's so ironic about people who call themselves Christians. The Old Testament was basically the ancient manual for the Jewish faith - not Christian. The New Testament is the statement of faith for the Christian religions. I think too many people hide their inadequacy and rage behind the guise of religion. Christians should be outrages at real examples of sin like the Catholic Church and the pedophile issues. But, ignorance will probably go on about gays with these kind of people because they refuse to know the entire truth. They pick put what they want to justify their own agendas.

Answer 10

First off who says that two men sharing a bed are gay? I slept in a bed with my sister while I was young does that mean we had relations? Of course not. The generality you applied to all Christians can be applied to your interpretation of what the verse says. That's my point they are vague and can be interpreted a number of different ways. Just as the teachings of Islam can be interpreted a number of different ways after all look how Al-Queda interpret some of the verses.

With that being said I agree with you, you have to search long and far in order to find versus that you could use to support "the hatred of gays". However, what's clear is the fact that it's the golden rule itself which says to treat your neighbor as you would want to be treated. After all the Golden Rule trumps any verse that was inferred in the first place.

Answer 11

You have just about summed it all up.
Just remember that only part of the Christian Church
condems Homosexuality. mostly the Catholic and Babtist branches.
Other's not only see "nothing wrong with being GAY" they also ORDAIN Gay & Lesbians ministers.
They all read the same Bible but the interpetation is hugely different.
Don't Forget that if the Bible were interpeted literally
those same Christians against omosexuality would have to also believe that the Earth is flat and that the Sun goes around the Earth.
cowboy [e-mail]