Mormons, Why are you not accusing Christ of being a liar when you say the Church fell into total apostasy?

Question

(Mat 28:20 DRB) Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you. And behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world.

(Mat 7:24 DRB) Every one therefore that heareth these my words, and doth them, shall be likened to a wise man that built his house upon a rock,

(Mat 7:25 DRB) And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and they beat upon that house, and it fell not, for it was founded on a rock.

(Mat 7:26 DRB) And every one that heareth these my words and doth them not, shall be like a foolish man that built his house upon the sand,

(Mat 7:27 DRB) And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and they beat upon that house, and it fell, and great was the fall thereof.

(Mat 7:28 DRB) And it came to pass when Jesus had fully ended these words, the people were in admiration at his doctrine.

(Mat 7:29 DRB) For he was teaching them as one having power, and not as the scribes and Pharisees.

(Mat 16:18 DRB) And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

aldy:

It is questioning the veracity of Christ who said that His Church was an enduring Church on a foundation of rock.

Proud to be LDS: fine, just show me where Jesus taught that the Church would fall into apostasy and be in need of restoration. In order to be right you must show where Jesus contradicted His own words in establishing His Church.

Proud to be LDS: fine, where is any evidence of this apostasy. Jesus clearly said that apostasy of the Church is impossible. Therefore if it occurred He is a liar. Right or why not?

Proud to be LDS:

Revelation 12 is speaking of the last days and not the beginning of the Church. Try again.

Isolde,

I am an early Church Scholar and professor and I find your speculation to be false. There was no apostasy as you claim in the Church. Emperors and kings never choose leaders in the Church and it was always done as in the first century Church of Acts when Bishops chose disciples to secede them in authority. Never was the use of the Bible discouraged. It is true that some mistranslated the Bible which the Church did not endorse for obvious reasons. As I said, Christ taught that the Church would endure for all times without falling into apostasy and said that it is and will always be the “bulwark and ground of the truth”. If Mormons are correct then Christ is a liar and a fool and is undeserving of our respect much less our worship. Conversely, Joseph Smith is a liar and a false teacher. As a Christian I must believe Christ and not an imposter.

Answer 1

The Church, not Christ, was being called into question.

Answer 2

If you look at how the Church was established in the Book of Acts and compare this to the church as it became as the state religion of Rome, you will see the transformation. When church leaders were chosen by emperors and kings, the plain and simple truths disappeared. Even the use of the Bible was discouraged for centuries. Men were killed or imprisoned for translating it into modern languages.

When the leaders of the Refomation challenged the doctrines of the church, it lead back toward Christ, but they lacked authority to organize and teach correct doctrine. Hence a restoration of the Church with priesthood authority is necessary.

Answer 3

We don't claim Christ left us we claim that mankind left his true doctrine for a time...Here's a few of the Bible verses that support that there was an apostasy...

Acts 3:19-21Times of restitution
2 Cor 2:17Many corrupt the word of God
2 Cor 4:2-4Gospel hid to those who are lost
Eph 4:11-14Perfect the saints; Apostasy
2 Thes 2:1-3Apostasy foretold
1 Tim 4:1-3forbidding to marry & to abstain from meat
2 Tim 3:1-5,Perilous times shall come
2 Peter 2:1-2false prophets and teachers
3 John 1:9-10Diotrephes, who loveth preeminence
Amos 8:11 A famine of hearing the word

The parable of the Wicked Husbandman Matt 21, Mark 12, Luke 20.

Answer 4

god only allowes his chruch to remain on the earth as long as people are ready to hear the truth, when his church is changed with out his permission he takes it away.

he never contradicted himself- it was through the weakness of men that the apostesy happened at all

you want to see in the bible where the apostasy is talked about read revelations12

no that is chapter 11
in chapter 12 the woman is the gospel- verse 6
"and the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of god, that they should feed her therea thousand two hundred and threescore days" then read through the end of the chapter-
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
pay particular attention to the last verse-satan caused all of the apostles to be killed because they followed the commandments and all others who followed the truth as well were killed
there is the apostasy

i've got a question for you where does Christ say that the apostasy is impossible?

Answer 5

scripture interpretation...you need to find that out....