Once again, a question was asked of christians and they don`t seem to know their own scripture....?

Question

The recent question about abortion being a sin. Apparently no one else has noticed this, but your god condones or orders it.

Hosea 9:11-16 Hosea prays for God’s intervention. “Ephraim shall bring forth his children to the murderer. Give them, 0 Lord: what wilt thou give? Give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts. . .Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit: yea though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb.” Clearly Hosea desires that the people of Ephraim can no longer have children. God of course obeys by making all their unborn children miscarry. Is not terminating a pregnancy unnaturally “abortion”?

Numbers 31:17 (Moses) “Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every women that hath known man by lying with him.” In other words: women that might be pregnant, which clearly is abortion for the fetus.

And there`s more!! Christians, how did you miss this??

Hosea 13:16 God promises to dash to pieces the infants of Samaria and the “their women with child shall be ripped up”. Once again this god kills the unborn, including their pregnant mothers.

2 Kings 15:16 God allows the pregnant women of Tappuah (aka Tiphsah) to be “ripped open”.

Come on christians, surely you can come up with something better than ``ìt`s out of context``??

How the heck would these be different IN context??

Excuses, excuses.

Answer 1

Yeah, blood thirsty son of a *****, isn't he?

I love how these people always justify this sort of thing by saying 'Well, they were sinners, so they deserved it." Or the old classic "You're reading it out of context."
Which you aren't in this case.

Answer 2

It's interpretations like that that caused the Crusades and the current mess in Iraq.
For your first verse: Since when was a miscarriage an unnatural termination of pregnancy? As for the bit about slaying the fruit of their womb, what version are you looking at? NIV has it "Even if they bear children, I will slay their cherished offspring." The New American version is similar, also adding the provision that the children must be born first.

For the second one:Your verse from Numbers is taken completely out of context. If you read the preceding verses, you learn that the Israelites had been betrayed by the Midianites and ordered to avenge their fallen comrades. The women in question were responsible for said betrayal, so Moses (not God) ordered their death. See also Numbers 25:1-18. Also, last I checked, killing a pregnant woman and her child was murder, not abortion.

Finally, maybe you haven't read the new testament, but God has mellowed out a bit over the years. Christ's teachings take priority over those in the old testament and, of course, the first among those is love thy neighbor as thyself, which is quite a ways away from the "eye for an eye" days of yore that you're quoting. How'd you miss that??

Answer 3

Truly you are twisting the scriptures for you own benefit.

The fact that God condemned some to death for a variety of reasons is no different that what society does today with the death penalty and their warmongering.

In numbers God told the Israelites to kill all of the Midianites, the male children and the non-virgin females. That has nothing to do with abortion -- it had to do with God's vengeance.

Numbers 31:15-17 Said: Why have you saved the women? 16Are not these they, that deceived the children of Israel by the counsel of Balaam, and made you transgress against the Lord by the sin of Phogor, for which also the people was punished? 17Therefore kill all that are of the male sex, even of the children: and put to death the women, that have carnally known men.

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We may be assured that among these killed here that they will get a review and a possible resurrection in paradise if they are numbered among the unrighteous and not the wicked.

Thus God will give any 'deserving' soul a chance for eternal life. This assurance Paul provides in Romans chapter 2.

And as far as your misuse of the word, be assured that God knows this too. Every one is paid back without partiality -- righteousness saves. Remember that.

Answer 4

In Hosea, God is punishing wickedness and abominations (Hosea 9:10). You probably missed that.
In Numbers God is punishing what? wickedness among the Midianites.
Do you see a theme? It is that the wicked are destroyed by God.
Abortion is MURDER, as is killing any innocent, is a contemptable act. It is a sin, confirmed by our Lord:
Even so, it is not the will of the Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. -Matthew 18:14.

BTW Get a REAL Bible, your translation is suspect. And maybe learn that the OT is full of lessons of things for us to avoid, rather than commands to do things.
OH, and if you can find some Ephraimites and Midianites, well I guess you probably... Nah, you are 100% wrong. I guess God's prophesy was probably true in these cases.

Answer 5

Jews do consider that abortion is legal under some circumstances but those verses are indeed out of context. Do you honestly believe that the situations which occur before and after those quotations have no bearing to there meaning.

The origin of the Jewish belief that abortions may be acceptable comes from the verse which explains that if a ma accidentally causes a miscarriage, he is to pay the woman a fine but he is not charged as a murderer or even with manslaughter.

Answer 6

God neither condones nor orders abortion. Hosea was speaking from a cultural background in which it was common to curse one's enemies in very symbolic language. To the ancient Israelites (and in many modern cultures), to be childless was a mark of God's disapproval. Hosea was wishing the very worst thing that he could think on the enemies of his people -- that they be without heirs to pass on the family name and traditions.

And in any event, miscarriage and abortion are two entirely different situations. Miscarriage is the spontaneous loss of the baby, while abortion is the deliberate termination of the pregnancy. One is done without the mother's consent, and the other is the result of a deliberate choice. God said, "Thou shalt do no murder," and abortion is the murder of a child in its mother's womb.

Using passages like these to justify your anti-Christian bias is pretty lame, BTW. As a wise man once said, "Text without context is pretext," and that's exactly what a question like this is.

Next time before you try to discredit Christianity by quoting obscure OT passages, you might at least study the historical and cultural background of those verses. This is one Christian who hasn't missed anything about those passages because she's studied Bible history and customs.

Answer 7

These innane rantings from the Bible is just one more example of how man has taken the concepts God has put forth to them and twisted them to promote their own agenda. It is through this very action that every religion known to man was conceived and it is because of things like this that can be found in Every religion to some degree that I have learned to Go To The Source...and to ignore the teachings of man.

With a very personal and ungoing relationship with my Creator, I have learned that things like these are not of his character nor are many of the other teachings from various religions.

Seek not the "wisdom" of man is probably the only completely TRUE statement made in the Bible.

Answer 8

Jews for Jesus is a Christian enterprise based via a guy named Martin Rosen, who spoke of as himself Moishe Rosen as a fashion to sound extra Jewish. Rosen curiously became into born Jewish, yet switched over to Christianity - meaning he's an apostate - and curiously won ordination from the Baptist church. the team has persevered to receive investment from the Baptist church. I as quickly as had a communique with Rosen on AOL (i'm so sorry i did no longer shop it) wherein he pronounced he had began the team as a company test. a number of the contributors of Jews for Jesus have been born Jewish and as such, they proceed to be Jewish although in a state of apostasy. besides the fact that, they are Jewish in that they'd not could desire to flow by way of a conversion technique in the event that they ever come to their senses. different contributors have no connection with Judaism different than what they have created of their minds (like being 'grafted on'). One stable effect from Jews for Jesus is they inspired the form of a team spoke of as Jews for Judaism. Zvi the Fiddler

Answer 9

this kind of Lets take the old testament out of its context and see what we can come up with questions are pretty bad. You just don't know what you're talking about. This question is pretty much like those questions about evolution in which the phrase :"Evolution is just a theory" appear, only its not about evolution, its about the Bible, it just makes no sense, youre only trying to atack something you know nothing about...

paz de Cristo.

Answer 10

Sadly again all you get are the cop out answers of it is god's choice and blah blah blah. Don't expect people who believe in a religion to read their respective holy books. The only people who actually read the full book are the opponents of that religion. With a few rare exceptions of course.

Answer 11

I didn't realize Atheists believed the Bible was written by God. I believe the Bible was written by HUMANS, with certain ideas about God. The Bible isn't a how-to. Whatever, I'm tired of answering your smarmy questions.