Calling all Christians!! Questions for you!?

Question

First off, I am agnostic.. so I am not trying to bash anyone's beliefs.. I am just trying to sort this out..

Much of what a Christian believes is heavily reliant on a person's ability to make a choice.. that God has given us free will.. After all without free will choices would not be possible.. neither would morals for that matter..

And YET whenever something bad happens, all I hear from Christians is "It was meant to be", or "It was part of God's plan".. These are very deterministic statements.. and very contradictory to the belief in free will.. If everything is "meant to be" then NOTHING is left to choice.. every so-called decision we make is just part of "God's plan".

So my question is, do you believe God has given us free will, or do you believe that God has a plan? It is not possible to have both, and of that you cannot convince me otherwise..

Just curious what Christians REALLY believe..

Answer 1

You have stumbled across a major debate inside Christianity. Some Christians believe that there is a doctrine of predestination. Basically it takes that God has chosen the elect and your life is a reflection of that choice. Others believe that free will is the dominate force.

Additionally there are Christians who have not logically looked at the beliefs and can spout arguments from both sides without there being any contradiction in their minds.

I believe in free will, with the idea that God knows what would be best for me. It is up to me to do what is best for me in accordance with his plans for me. However, I could choose to do something contrary to His will and violate His plan for me. Then God still knows what is best for me and it is my choice to do that or violate yet again. See how all of these choices can make it rather confusing. It is like God has the ultimate flow chart for my life and I must turn each page to find out where it leads me. God on the other all ready knows.

Answer 2

I think what the real issue is revolves around a lot of people saying "It was meant to be" or "It was part of God's plan" too often.

As a Christian, I tell people that God will help give you strength to get through things, but do not figure out what is God's plan and what is not. Always try to do your best to make your situation better.

So I believe God has a plan. I don't think every detail of what happens is in that plan, though. And we have the choice of how we are going to act.

Matt

Answer 3

You are very correct. You cannot have both. I believe the same way that you do. I think some Christians actually don't truly believe in free will. I constantly here people saying that bad events are God's will or that God has a purpose in making them happen. I think that is absolute rubbish. If a child is murdered, I don't it is part of God's big plan. I think it was someone's cruel and selfish actions that ruined someone's family. If someone dies, I don't think God has called someone home. I think their life cycle has ended. It is part of life to end that life. The manner at which someone dies is up to chance. We do have choices in life. There is free will, and frankly, I am tired of hearing phrases like "It was God's plan" or "mean to be" in the Christian vocabulary. It is against the very idea that we have the freeedm to choose--that is at the very center of our faith. We choose to follow Christ or not.

Answer 4

That is called a false dichotomy. You force on me to choose between two choices.

Just because a father knows what his son will do does not eliminate the choice. Intelligence does not negate agency.

While many christians do throw around "it was meant to be" a bit to much, I agree, that doesn't mean nothing is planned.

He can know what we will do without forcing us to do it . This is a sign of intelligence, not coersion. One can plan for things without causing it to happen. If I am smart enough to predict the stock market, and make a plan around those changes, have I forced indevidual consumers to make the choices they did? Or is it just the logical outcome of people excersizing their free will in a predictable manner.

Do statistics force individual decision? If statistics state that 75% of people will do something, am I then forced by those statistics to do that act?

Christians throw around deterministic statements a bit to easily, I agree. It is comforting to believe that everything was Gods direct intervention.

But it is possible to have a plan, and free will. God can plan and predict and know without causing, just as I can invest with a (near) sure knowledge of events. I know gas prices will rise. In stating this I have caused it, nor have I removed indeviduals agency from the equation.

Answer 5

This is a very good question. First of all, God has given us free will to choose and make decisions. The greatest of these decisions being the choice to accept His offer of forgiveness of sins and to recieve eternal life. Now, when bad things happen (I'm talking in a Christian's life), such as being diagnosed with disease or maybe loosing a job, etc., this is not always the result of the choice that a Christian made, but rather, it is part of the grand scheme of life that God performs in our lives. The Psalmist David stated that the steps of a righteouss person is ordered of the Lord and Paul states that "all things work together for the good of those who love the Lord (Romans 8:28). Looking at such scriptures in light of what Jesus said in John 16:33: "in this world you shall have tribulation..." and the words of Paul again in Romans 5:3-5 (tribulation produces patience, patience produces character, character produces hope and hope does not make us ashamed because God's love is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost), we must then realize that sometimes God allows tragedy and trials to assail us, but this has nothing to do with our choosing but rather in such times, our free will is used to stay true and trust God or totally turn our backs upon Him. This is just a scratch on the surface of this subject, but unfortunately, according to your words, your mind is closed to the right response. Anyway, I hope that you will reconsider. By the way, all of humanity will face trouble, tragedy and storms, but as a Christian, I have an eternal Father and a Savior who promised to be with me always (Matthew 28:20). This I know from much experience.

Answer 6

I believe that God does have a plan, and we have the free will to chose to follow Him and His plan for our life, or not.

I also agree with you about Christians and their (our) statements. I do NOT think that everything that happens is God's plan. We have free will, we make our own choices, and we live in a world that is full of sin, therefore, we have consequences.

God does not make anything bad happen to anyone, but He does allow us to walk out the consequences of our choices.

Christians that blame everything on "Gods plan" most likely don't have a strong relationship with god, are an understanding of Him Word.

Answer 7

In all things you must look at the Big Picture. We are travelling on a piece of rock spinning at 1600 kilometres an hour, travelling around the Sun at 107,00 kilometres an hour, and our Solar system is moving through space at around 770,000 kilometres an hour. About 109 billion people have lived on this planet and there are about 10 times that figure of stars in the visible universe. Everyday around 250,000 people die and more than that are born. When people say "It is meant to be or It is part of God's plan" what they are really saying is that they don't understand. It is hard to make sense of any Tragedy, but when you place a singular tragedy with in the Frame work of the big picture that is our world. It can start to take on a different perspective and meaning. We need to assess everything that happens in our world against and infinite God, not our Finite framework of life. God has a plan but it is up to us and our freewill to choose to complete it.

Answer 8

I had a very interesting experience one day. I became aware, for a couple of hours, of God's plan unfolding in all the things around me. Cars moving around, birds flying through the air, people walking, all of the stuff that was going on around me was unfolding in perfect harmony to the divine plan. Yet at the same time I was aware that my own movements and those of others, even the birds, were freely chosen. Intellectually it is very hard for me to describe what this was like, but I tell you most sincerely that everything can be free and be part of God's plan at the same time. I have tasted exactly what you claim to be impossible. I just wish I could describe it better. God bless.

Answer 9

I agree that not everything that happens is God's will. I hear that all the time.......someone gets cancer....dies in a car accident........breaks a leg.......loses a home......etc. They say "it was God's will". I know all things that happen are "allowed" by God, because He could prevent anything bad from ever happening, but He doesn't. But that does not mean it was His will or plan. I don't believe it is ever His will for a person to get a terrible disease or be murdered, etc., but that those things happen because of man's free will. I do believe that God can bring good out of tragedies though, and take what the devil intended for evil and turn it for our good. That is where prayer comes in--when we invite the Lord to intervene and participate in our life.

Answer 10

I am a Christian Jehovah's Witness and I believe that God has a definite plan for the earth and for mankind in general but that each individual has free will to either fit in to that plan or not. There are consequences (results) for every choice we make including this one. Deuteronomy 30:19 expresses it best. The choice is ours.