How can God know the future, then create something, then judge it based on what he knows it will already do?

Question

Wouldn't that be like me making 2 sculptures out of clay; having one as a beautiful animal and the other as a rolled up, half-@ssed attempt at a snake, then judging the snake because it is not beautiful like the animal? If God knows the future and he knows in creating a person that they will turn out like Hitler did, or Napoleon, and still creates them, isn't it hypocritical for him to judge them based on what he created them to do? If free-will is not just an illusion, then God would not be able to know the future for certain, and if he did, then he is not a just God.

Please don't answer unless you have enough of a brain to understand what I am asking. I don't want to hear about so-and-so being the only way to glory and blah blah blah. Other than that please ge me insights.

Answer 1

you got a point

Answer 2

God creates every person with a plan and a destiny for that person. But it is their decision whether to follow it. Take Hitler for example. He appeared to have an electrify speaking style that could sway great crowds, and a brilliance for organization and leadership. Had he choosen to use those abilities for God, he could have saved his nation, brought peace and prosperity, and been one of the world's great heroes. But he choose not to.

If you read the Bible, it states in may plans that God's plan and will is not always done. If it was automatic, why would Christians be told to pray "your kingdom come, your will be done"? Paul, in Romans 12, talks about how we can walk in either the "perfect", the "acceptable" or the "good" will of God. (And by implication, not in his will at all). All through scripture you will see God having to correct people because they are outside of his will and plan.

God has an ultimate plan, and he will accomplish it in the end. But no where in the Bible is stated or implied that God has very decision that every person will make pre-planned. He COULD do that. He is powerful enough. But he didn't. He allows something called "free will". It simple means he respect your right to make your own moral decision, but then you stand by the consequences of them.

In your analogue, you made but the animal and the snake, and then punished the snake. In the Bible, God forms the clay and permits it to take either the shape of the animal or the shape of the snake by its own decision. If by its own decisions it becomes a snake, then it receives the consequences of those decision. If by its own decisions it becomes the animal, it receives the consequences of those decisions.

God did make Hitler or Napoleon. He made innocent babies full of potential for good. Hitler and Napoleon that decided what to do with that optential.

Answer 3

Believers cannot argue the fact that their god supposedly knows what will happen. If he knows that something he creates will definitely create evil, he is therefore responsible for this evil since he already knows the outcome. Christians will argue this and deny it up and down. Their claim is that we have free will to choose, however they seem to not understand that their god already knows the choice before it is made. It is a total disregard for logic, and it is a prime example of how they are intellectually dishonest.

Let us pretend for a moment that I placed a poisonous snake in the bed with my wife as she slept. The snake may or may not bite her; that is a part of its freedom to choose. If she is bitten, do I escape responsibility simply because the snake was the one who made the choice to bite? Absolutely not! I knew it was poisonous from the beginning. I knew it acted upon instinct. Does this god not know of our sin nature (poison)? Does this god not know of our instinct (free will)?

When presented with this argument, instead of admitting there is a problem here, Christians will try to change the subject. "Who are we to question God? How dare the creation question its creator! Does a pot question the potter?" But of course this only begs the question that God exists and that he created us. More circular logic rather than rational answers because they do not know the answers and cannot admit that they do not know the answers yet insist they are right.

Answer 4

In having free will, God have given you the choice to choose life or death. When He created the world He knew man was going to fall, but man did not have to fall. Adam and Eve could have made another choice and chose God over the devil. When God created the devil, He knew there would be some that would much rather follow the devil than him. Even with this in mind He sent His Son so that you would not be one of them.

God said he wish that none should perish; but some will. He is able to direct the course of history. For instance: when Jacob boys sold their brother into slavery, God used this occasion to save the very brothers that had done their brother Joesph wrong.

God made you, but He does not make you do the things that you do, such as disobey Him. We do that with our free will.

Answer 5

Okay, I will take a stab at answering this: What I believe is that God created all that IS in the beginning and then allowed nature and free will to take over from there. I don't think that teachings about God knowing everything were even intended by God to be interpreted as He knows our each and every move before it happens and how we will each individually turn out. I think man in general and religion specifically have taken the original teachings of God and His prophets and "interpreted" them to advance their own greedy and selfish causes for so long that the actual real Word of God has been so covered over that it is almost impossible to read in it's pure intended form. Each of us must ultimately seek and question and then reason out what we believe to be the real Truth. What I believe "He knows your future" means is that God sees the bigger picture and all the possible destinies that man might (might is the operative word here) achieve. He has left it in the world's hands to determine which of the possible destinies it achieves, but has also provided us a way to strengthen ourselves for a journey that will sometimes be hard. This is where prayer and grace come into the picture. We use these gifts to strengthen the good that is already hardwired into us, so to speak. Unfortunately, some choose to strengthen the bad. And there also has to be the capacity for bad in us or there could be no meaningful choices. Such is the nature of a free will. It is obvious to me that a kind and merciful God simply would not create a Hitler or the like, but that man takes the raw material God has provided and unfortunately, sometimes man makes a terrible mess of things, including the human being. Remember, we all make choices. So, to be brief and bring it down to a very personal level, what I believe is that God knows your future is to be a member of the human race with the attributes and various flukes of nature inherent to our species. He also knows that you will make choices with your free will and that those choices will impact the future in any number of ways. If He chose to look closely He could see at any given moment what you were doing, but seriously, why would He? I think God figured that we should be able to use the toilet and shower, or vomit or whatever secure, in our own privacy, not wondering if God is also watching THAT ! When you pray you have His attention. When you don't, well, you don't. Simple. It's like being a parent, we prepare you as best we can and then turn you loose and hope you use the skills we taught you, but of course, there is no guarantee you will. Ultimately when He judges you it will be based on your personal ability and level of EFFORT (not everyone's ability in this is the same as I am sure you have noticed, but amount of effort is infinite) to recognize right from wrong, good from from evil and the way in which you used your personal talents to help or hinder the world as a whole. It's like, if you know what wrong is and do it anyways, like Hitler, the impact on the world can be horrifying and your personal judgement will reflect that choice I am sure. But God does not punish your basic half-@ssed snake for doing something wrong if said snake does not know what wrong is. Of course that only applies if said snake had absolutely no opportunity to think and learn and figure out it was wrong as opposed to simply choosing to remain ignorant. Choosing not to know is also evil.By world I mean ALL that IS. I believe that in creating the human race God wanted creatures who would think and reason. Inherent in these abilities God recognized that He would have to relinquish a goodly amount of control ... there was just no other way to make it work. Knowing this and seeing that this opened the door for evil, He said, okay, it has to be this way if you are gonna get to think and make choices and I hate it, but I can't make it go away without taking away your free will, so here is the deal: if it ever gets so bad that it looks as though evil is really going to win it all, I will intervene (you know like Noah's ark and all that flooding!) on the side of good and save those who chose good. This won't happen very often at all though! So, be fruitful, multiply and let's see what all you creatures do with all this stuff given to you!!

Answer 6

and the free-will/punishment in hell myth is busted!!!!

we are meant to grow, to evolve, to make mistakes and learn from them. just look at a child growing up, how do they learn if they are not allowed to make mistakes?

there is free will, and we also get to experience the consequences- thus we evolve. this is not a punishment- there is no hell other than what hellish experiences you can experience here on earth or that are created in your mind. but they come with a purpose, and sometimes the lessons are much greater than on a personal level- like with Hitler the lesson is generational and world-wide...

also, the idea of reincarnation makes more sense here- you get lifetimes to evolve, the soul ascends through the human experience, and it may take many many lifetimes to reach the highest high. when you re-incarnate in the next life, you are given the experiences that will most help you evolve.

Answer 7

It may not be the case that god already knows what we will do.

It could be possible that god sees all possible futures for every choice that is made and every choice within each choice. It is a vast scale of knowledge but I guess that why god would be god.

So with that in mind free will would still exist in a sense and you would still be judged on your actions. Since god would know all the outcomes and the results of all the outcomes but he would not know what choice you make but only the results of each choice.

The problem is that you could still argue that god doesn't know everything but by knowing all possible outcome he in effect does know everything.

I hope that makes sense. because my head is starting to hurt

Answer 8

People are wrong to think God created creation with the thought of creation going wrong. To understand creation one must first understand that in the OT, God was called YHWH and that God became Jesus Christ who is subject to his Father God, or The Ancient of Days that no man has seen or spoken to.
God wants a family. He is seperating good from evil here in the physical dimension. As far as him knowing what happens 10 minutes from now, I don't think he gives much thought about. Free will affects the future and any man can choose to be something different than what he is naturally.
Our struggle is about defeating our own nature to do bad things. I think that creation was a chance to choose to not be what God knows we are, and not do what God knows we are capable of doing.
The future is not a set rule, in other words. If a man will change than he chooses it himself. God doesn't sit back and determine our fate. God simply witnesses it when we choose it for ourselves.
God did not create Hitler. God created Adam and Eve and they had children and those children had children and each one of them became whatever they became.
If I kill a policeman and my mother and father always told me to kill is wrong, you cannot say my mother and father created me to kill. I simply did not resist my nature to kill an I am still in need of punishment.
God is perfect. YHWH was born and did no wrong. That was his proof to us it is possible. Now we can be saved through him and still be imperfect beings. How much kinder can God get?

Answer 9

God is just and He has a purpose for all things. Even for a person like yourself who dares to analyze Him with your limited intellectual way of thinking!

He knew that you would be asking this question because He gave you the free will to do so! He's GOD, and His ways are past finding out! But, you can ask Him for more input to your question..just call on him and see for yourself!

Peace,

Hope

Answer 10

It is a mystery but my idea is that God does not know although He is able to know. He prevents Himself from that knowledge. Or else, He somehow allows free will but then is able to work around our actions so that His purposes are accomplished anyway.

Answer 11

I think that us not being able to comprehend this vast and interesting question is partly what makes Him God and us not. What do you think?