Discussions about the Bible with the JW's....?

Question

Not to pick on them only, but...have you ever had a Bible study or a discussion about a topic in the Bible with someone, and not only are they always right, but they zip you around the Bible, and insist on making their point be the right one? I have had this happen everytime I'd try having a study with a witness. A discussion seems to get nowhere, even tho I may actually know the truth about a particular topic. So, why would anyone discussing the Bible, NOT be open to trying to get the truth of the subject, even if they would have to change their view?
We are supposed to "prove all things", RIGHT?
So, why won't some people use any literature,including some that might not be their own, to prove something or to gain new knowledge?
Are some people closing their mind and heart to the truth, believing that they have all the answers?
Wouldn't God want us to search for the truth, and change, if we have to?

Sorry if I gave the impression that I am currently studying with the witnesses. I am NOT!My cousin is a witness, and discussions come up sometimes, and I'm not trying to make a point in a discussion with her,( being right isn't my objective!) I just try to arrive at the truth, and she doesn't ever go out of her "comfort zone" and see if there is more truth out there...The attitude seems to be that a certain group of people have the "TRUTH" or the correct answer, and it's hard to prove otherwise!

My2cents, there is absolutely no doubt in my mind or heart that I know who I'm worshipping...God, and my savior Jesus Christ! Do you know who you're worshipping?

abdijah: you mention the Sabbath in this discussion, and even tho that is a stretch from my original question, I'd like to ask you a question concerning the Sabbath. The Sabbath, according to Scripture, is the 7th day, which I believe and observe. I've not heard of the witnesses observing a 7th day, Saturday Sabbath!

Answer 1

I have had much discussion with JWs. It really is the most challenging thing you will undertake in trying to witness the biblical gospel to them. Yes, you are right a person should be willing to change their views if they don't match up to the clear teaching of Scripture. Space here does not permit me do go into full length however, here are some things to keep in mind when talking with them
1.) It is helpful to study and understand the history of the Society and how it has developed over the past 100 years since Charles Taze Russell founded it in 1913 and what prompted Russell to found it in the first place. Many doctrinal changes have taken place between now and then and around a half dozen predictions that the Armageddon would happen by a specific date. It isn't necessary to become a scholar, but be informed.
2.) As a stragety you won't make any progress until you get them to question the "unquestionable" authority of the Watchtower Society. Tell them you have specific questions about the Society. This gets them off their well rehersed answered about the diety of Christ or the Trinity. Think about it; If the Witnesses are asking you to committ to the Society then you have a lot of questioins about the Soiety.
3.) Remember that God may be merely using you to plant a seed and you are one person along the way and not the person who will see that JW come out of the Society. The best you can do is ask questions that make them think. I read once that for twenty years a JW kept thinking about a question an evangelical asked him. After all that thinking he left the Society, but it took twenty years!
4.) I have read many books that critque the Society and by far the best one is "Approaching Jehovah's Witnesses in Love: How to Witness Effectively Without Arguing" by Wilbur Lingle. The book is not terribly thick and is very easy to read.
5.) As a matter of principle never have a discussion with the JWs alone. Insist on a one on one discussion or a two on two discussion. Never have a discussion by yourself with two JWs. It is part of their stragety to overwhelm you and keep you off balance with those odds. Invite someone who is more expericenced with you to the discussion, but let the JWs know about this ahead of time and get them to agree to it.
Hope that helps.

Answer 2

I'm sorry, but I'm not getting the question.

Going from scripture to scripture (using the Bible) is what I thought a Bible discussion was about.

You did mention an interesting point. You said, "A discussion seems to get nowhere, even tho I may actually know the truth about a particular topic." It may seem to go nowhere from anyone's standpoint if they feel they already know the answer about something. Try something you don't know the answer to already. On both ends, searching the scriptures with an open mind and a will to understand the truth is way more beneficial than just trying to prove a point.

Answer 3

"Not to pick on them only." Oh, yeah? Then why did you just single out JW's? Jehovah's Witnesses do NOT "zip" around the Bible, as you say. When they have Bible studies with others, they go at a pace that is suitable for the person they are studying with. And they don't insist on anything. If they have a point that needs a Bible reference, what's wrong with using the Scriptures to back up what they are talking about? If you feel the discussion is going nowhere, is that the Witness's fault, or does the hangup rest with you?

"Are some people closing their mind and heart to the truth, believing that they have all the answers?" Jehovah's Witnesses do not have all the answers. That's why they study the Bible too, privately and at their 5 weekly meetings. If there is something that concerns you, why not ask the person you are having Bible discussions with? Posing your concerns in an open forum will just get you erroneous or conflicting replies.

Answer 4

Well, my first inclination would be a joke and say "don't try this at home." Now that I've got that off my chest...

If you want to discuss the Bible with JWs, you have to understand ahead of time how they think and that they've been led to believe that the biblical research provided for them by their leadership (whom they consider to be the fulfillment of the "faithful and discreet slave" prophecy) is the only way to understand the Bible.

They will resist anything that's not specifically from the Bible. Your presentation of even a strictly biblical point would have to be couched in very careful language.

If you expect to be discussing a particular topic with a JW, you need to research it ahead of time. The internet has become a great place to do this because ex-witnesses have been trying to get the word out about the many fallacies to their logic. You will be able to find resources that have scriptural arguments for many of their strongly-held positions. (freeminds.org has links to lots of discussion sites about this stuff, as well as piles of information right there.) But realize that you must present your arguments in the most conversational way possible. If you make statements like: "that reminds me of the scripture at....." and then you both read from the Bible, you can ask them to comment. If you've selected verses outside the scope of the witness rationale (and those verses are truly there), you may force them to reason from their own minds.

It will make them uncomfortable to think that they've encountered a point that has a possible alternate explanation. You have to resist the desire to "win" an argument in a single discussion. In fact, if you give the impression that you're arguing, they won't play the game. But if you leave them feeling that they need to go away and do more research so that they can come back to you with the "witness" answer, you just might win in the long run. Any time they feel compelled to research a point that isn't as clear as they'd assumed, it opens up a little niche in their brains.

But you CAN'T use other literature. They've been brainwashed to "protect" themselves from the influences of "false religion." And you CAN'T tell them you've been researching your topic anywhere else but from the Bible.

But KNOW THIS: Absolutely every single JW I have ever known has a personal list of doubts. They keep this list to themselves. To openly question could get them in trouble. They carry it around and try to suppress it, "waiting on Jehovah" to eventually clear it up for them. It varies from person to person. I'm sure a lot of them are concerned about witness-specific issues, like the child molester coverup cases what with the big settlement a couple weeks ago, and the confusion over blood transfusions, seeing that there is no clear-cut rule for them to follow anymore. But there are likely to be more subtle questions... especially since the Watchtower has flipflopped on quite a few issues over the years. One of my favorites is actually about the resurrection of the men of Sodon. It's a hoot.

Anyway, if you really want to engage a witness productively, you have to play the game by their rules. You have to understand witness-speak. You have to guide them so that they always feel they are helping YOU. Once you come across as teaching them instead of ASKING them, all their cult-protection guards will pop up.

Good luck.

Answer 5

Here's a simple truth.

Jesus said to a Samaritan woman at the well in John 4:22-23 "YOU worship what YOU do not know; we worship what we know, because salvation originates with the Jews. 23 Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshipers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for, indeed, the Father is looking for suchlike ones to worship him. "

Now let's look at some people in past that are like your cousin and yourself. Take a pick which one of these do you think you, yourself represent?

Abel and Cain; Abraham's wife (Sarah) and Lot's wife; Mose and Pharos; apostle John and Judas Iscariot; Jesus' apostles and pharisees; Jews and Samaritans

The point is, do you know your God that you are worshipping? Your cousin knows his/her God.

Answer 6

yes , i do believe we are supposed to look for the truth . however we are all brothers & sisters in other words family in God's eyes . i suggest taking everything w/ a grain of salt.i do also believe that I've read in the bible anyone who is not against you is for you. i just dont remember where exactly it is in the bible & for that I humbly appologize. i hope this will help. take care.

Answer 7

I say this kindly: do you not exhibit a smattering of the 'crime' you accuse JWs of? You said, "...even tho I may actually know the truth about a particular topic". JWs are sincerely convinced they know the truth about many topics, and they are just bursting to share it with poor souls who have been deluded by Satan. So, naturally, they are going to stick to the tried and tested formula that wins converts. Statements are printed by their leaders with various "butterfly" texts to "prove" them, questions are printed to lead you to the printed answers in the paragraphs.... unwary individuals are led along a path that makes it seem entirely logical that JWs are the only people on earth being blessed by Jehovah God. A little bit of humility wouldn't go amiss, would it? (and I'm not refering to you.)

All Christians know that salvation comes from faith in Christ alone (even the JWs acknowledge that truth, in theory). Faith in him and what he has accomplished at Calvary is the only thing that will save anybody - JWs included. So, when you spot them insisting that faith in their leaders is also required, and their baptismal formula involves obedience to their leaders.... well, you hear warning bells, don't you? You also notice that they say (on paper) that we must change our beliefs if it's proven necessary: "It is important for each one of us to examine his religion... If we are lovers of the truth, there is nothing to fear from such an examination. ...If a religion really accepts the Bible as God's Word, it is not going to use certain parts of it and reject other parts..." Yet they only seem to apply that to YOU! And they keep focussing on certain passages in those book studies - the ones that suit them. They rationalise away verses that don't suit them whilst accusing others of doing the same thing (which does go on, but two wrongs don't make a right).

So, you are not going to get anywhere with them if you spot such things and sooner or later the JWs will drop you if you keep "resisting" their "truth". God wants us to search for the truth, but not in literature other than the Bible. His word leads us to The Word of God - Christ, revealing him in his awesome glory. Only divine revelation removes the scales from our eyes and the plugs in our ears, and softens our hearts. Any Christian who only points you to Jesus has discovered him to be the Way, the Truth and the Life. Those who point to an organization are blind guides. "Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an organization, not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the Bible. For this reason the Bible cannot be properly understood without Jehovah's visible organization in mind... We all need help to understand the Bible, and we cannot find the Scriptural guidance we need outside the 'faithful and discreet slave' organization." Pray God will remove the scales from their eyes, as he did the Apostle Paul.

Answer 8

You are right seaching for the truth is what God wants. To that end, if you knew/know in your heart and mind that your answer is right, and someone asks you won't you show them?

Answer 9

Because some one once said that JESUS was the ArchAngel, Michael, they strongly believe in that notion!

You can take any 'verses' and twist them around to your way of thinking, and some one else use the same verses and twist them around to thiers along with supporting verses... But, read the thing as a whole, and find the truth in it all...

When some one shows me a verse, I usually read the paragraph before and after, so that the verse will not be taken out of context...

Oh, its almost impossible to 'turn' a JW around... they are so 'ingrained' in thier ideas, that only the LORD can bring them about, not us...and if the LORD doesnt put it in thier "hearts", there is nothing we can do, HE has to open thier eyes...

I wish you well...

Jesse

Answer 10

It seems very odd to criticize a Christian's familiarity with the bible, and even more odd to criticize a Christian for looking to the bible (rather than human opinion) as the authority for his faith.

(Acts 17:2-3) [Paul] reasoned with them from the Scriptures, explaining and proving by references [from the bible]


Of course true Christians (such as Jehovah's Witnesses) want to search for the truth; where is the best reference of truth?
http://watchtower.org/e/bible/heb/chapter_004.htm?bk=heb;chp=04;vs=12;citation#bk6

(Psalm 119:159-160) I have loved your own orders. O Jehovah...your word is truth

(John 17:11,17) Holy Father, watch over them... Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth.

(Hebrews 4:12) For the word of God is alive and exerts power and is sharper than any two-edged sword


It is not adherence to some human group that defines "truth", but one's adherence to the inspired infallible Word of the Divine Author as found in the bible.

(1 Thessalonians 2:13) When YOU received God’s word, which YOU heard from us, YOU accepted it, not as the word of men, but, just as it truthfully is, as the word of God

Learn more:
http://watchtower.org/archives/index.htm#bible