Theists: Why doesn't GOD give us free will to make only good choices...?

Question

for ourselves as well as mankind? Why throw the nukes in there. I wouldn't feel like a programmed robot if I had the "free will" to make choices about my journey that didn't involve maiming, killing and emotionally damaging others. I wouldn't feel like a programmed robot treating people humanely and being treated the same in return.

Why all the nukes and drugs... oh, wait, that's Satan right? If God was so powerful he could have never created Satan. Satan wasn't created to give us "free will". Other than the fact that he's a fairy tale, like his creator, he could only have been existent to make God happy. Why would God want to be unhappy? And why does happiness include murder, genocide and abuse?

Free will, nothing. If God was any kind of God he would have given us the free will to make the choices we wanted to in our lifetimes, all of them ways to make us happy and content with ourselves and eachother.

Wow, Jack. If you could do anything and everything you wanted to without hurting yourselves and others for a very limited lifetime you would find it boring? Perhaps you need some new interests. There are infinite good things to try to do and be in this lifetime. I'm sorry your view is so narrow.

*Crisajt123* - "...It sounds like a person just rambling on about nothing know about." What do you call that statement? If you truly cannot understand the simple terms in which I've put it (there are infinitely good choices. There is only one lifetime. Take up painting or study or read. Dance, sing, be. You've only got one lifetime as far as we all know. Why wouldn't God want us to enjoy it all?) then you probably shouldn't bother answering the question anyway.

AGAIN, I DO NOT BLAME ANY OF IT ON GOD OR SATAN. I AM AN ATHEST. I TOO BELIEVE THAT WE SHOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR OUR OWN ACTIONS. I ASK THIS SOLELY BECAUSE I CANNOT UNDERSTAND THE BELIEF IN GOD AND SATAN. Thank you. :-)

Oh my Gah, Free! Free! Why shouldn't it be possible to have the free will to do only the infinitely positive things out there and whichever we choose to do we will do? We've only got a lifetime here on earth! I don't believe that any loving God would create mankind to destroy itself. Period. That is not choice. It is evil. Why isn't free will free will when the choices are infinite and all good? Really?

Chdoctor - How presumptuous of you to believe that choosing God is "right". Are you getting this from the Bible? The Bible gave us God. God created the Bible. It is circular logic.

WHY would any loving God need us to have the so-called 'free choice' to be miserable and nasty people? WHY NOT JUST GIVE US THE FREE WILL TO CHOOSE OF THE FOUNTAIN OF WONDER AND KNOWLEDGE? PLEASE ANSWER THE QUESTION AT HAND. Thank you again. ;-P

Hey *Kat* - I really don't appreciate LIARS. I made it very clear in my previous statement that I too approve of medical marijuana and that I have been known to smoke a j here and there myself. In fact, I SPECIFICALLY said that medical marijuana should be legal in fact. IF you have a point, please make it without lying in order to justfy yourself. Sheesh. I guess lying is a "minor sin" to you, eh? A forgivable one? Because you do it, right? Again, get real.

OK, Darian. I should have said "Christians" because that was really who this question is directed toward. I have many Pagan, Asatruar, Christian, Muslim and Jewish friends (I am of Jewish heritage) but I should have pointed this out as a Christian question. I have many spiritual beliefs as well, I simply don't believe in a god or gods.

Cinderella - Heh? I said the free will to live our lives in a manner harmonious to one another and ourselves. I never said unhealthy. I never mentioned that children would just go rampaging the candy stores. That wouldn't be very good, would it? And what kind of God would create tooth decay anyway?

There is absolutely no limit to the unending choices we can make on our journies through life that are good - if God exists then why does He/She/It need to add in the rest of it. What do you find limiting about choosing to do what makes you happy (arts, science, technology, psychology)? And yes, I did mention psychology. Why? Because we have only one lifetime we know of. Therefore we will lose people we love, even in our best choices. They will die. Everyone should be helped through grief.

My point is, however, that it is impossible for a loving God to see it any other way.

Cinderella - Heh? I said the free will to live our lives in a manner harmonious to one another and ourselves. I never said unhealthy. I never mentioned that children would just go rampaging the candy stores. That wouldn't be very good, would it? And what kind of God would create tooth decay anyway?

There is absolutely no limit to the unending choices we can make on our journies through life that are good - if God exists then why does He/She/It need to add in the rest of it. What do you find limiting about choosing to do what makes you happy (arts, science, technology, psychology)? And yes, I did mention psychology. Why? Because we have only one lifetime we know of. Therefore we will lose people we love, even in our best choices. They will die. Everyone should be helped through grief.

My point is, however, that it is impossible for a loving God to see it any other way.

(((Baza)))

THANK YOU RANDY!!

Answer 1

Some good points. This god, can not be omniscient by the definition as presented by the good christians of our planet. The question of Satan for one is a clearly contrived concept of mankind. This being of "pure evil" this " Prince of the power of the air" Would have been forseen by this omniscient god even before the conception of this god'sexistance was ever thought of. To fit this projection of flawed logic we would have to buy into the mindset of using "faith" to rationalise this all knowing all loving god and it's self conception. This is a paradox that is not to be worked out, becouse of the emotional needs of humans and their unwillingness to let go of the inprinted thought patterns that they embrace with all of their emotion. It is a good feeling to feel that this scary world is governed by some all knowing being that has our best intrest in mind. This is just not so and the evidence is all around us. We could get moving on a soultion to the worlds problems if we shed this religious habit that we as humans cling to so strongly. The claims that we are granted free will by an omniscient being, or that this being has free will itself are flawed in logic. But they are pushed to millions of deluded people in every move they make thrueout their lives. the concept of sin and punishment or redemption from sin is the core of the activity in their lives when by their own explainantion of this god they interject free will as if this omniscient god has the power to exact free will even upon it's own self, in clear violation of logic and reason which it has bestowed upon mankind in the christian belief. It just does not make sence to the rational mind.

Answer 2

If God gave us free will to only make good choices, then it would no longer be free will because it would be limited will
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The exact possibility you are mentioning would not give us free will at all. Free will does not have terms or limitations. If we are good people like so many claim then why can't we just do good. God's will if for us to make those good choices, but we don't choose them do we?

A good majority of the time we do not. Adam and Eve lived in the exact state that you were talking about. It is called Paradise. And they screwed it up. Since then, man has been doing the same thing as Adam and Eve. Before they made the choice to disobey, they did what was right and then they chose to do what they wanted to. Sin started with them.

Answer 3

Free will is free. If you limit it in some direction, it isn't free.

That's like asking God to create water that isn't wet. Logical impossibilities aren't His department, sorry... you need to ask the atheists about those!

To make an analogy, my friend loves me because she chooses to. That makes a friendship. If she just liked me because she was told to hang out with me, or if she was nice to me just to get some kind of reward, that's not a friendship. That's just one person using, and another person being used.

God created beings who can decide whether to love Him or not, whether to do right or to do wrong. If you do something right because it is the right thing to do, or in order to please God, this is a good thing. If, on the other hand, you do something right but you had no choice in the matter -- you were compelled to do it, then you are only a puppet or a robot, not a self-aware human being with the power of choice.

Answer 4

So you're an atheist are you? You don't believe in God?

It was God that breathed the breath of life into your lungs and gave you life. He did this knowing that you were going to post dumb stuff like this and be lost in the wilderness.

Before you spout ridiculous statements as to what is a fairy tale, etc. you should seek knowledge and make an "informed" statement. You should seek information/knowledge before you talk about things that is obvious you know nothing about.

I'm not being mean and I truly don't intend to be cruel but how can you determine that you are an atheist if you haven't sought God first?

Join a Bible study. Search until you find an enlightened church that you can relate to as far as peers. (Meaning, if you're a young person, go to a church that has people your age in the congregation). Take some time to study the Bible. You don't have to join a church to learn. You can attend Bible study and go to church as long as you want without joining. Seek knowledge first.

All of the answers you are seeking are in the Bible. All of them. Though the components of the Bible were written by different men at different times (hundreds of years apart) and from different areas (Greece, Middle East, Asia, etc) and none of them knew of each other (no email, internet, blogs or even copies of each others information) they all prophesied the same things. From the Old Testament where men prophesied on the coming Savior (all things happened exactly as they all predicted) to the New Testament where the last days before the return of Christ are prophesized (all of those events are happening now) all things have been found to be exact. No book has been studied more then the Bible and no book has been scrutinized for errors more then the Bible. None have been found. By anyone, ever!

The Bible says that God wants us to have life and have it abundantly. He wants us to live life to the fullest and enjoy life but in decency and in order. True we have but one life. We are born to die. However, we choose to die in Christ or apart from Christ. We choose to spend eternity with God or apart from God.

When you die, your body dies. What happens to the "you" that is on the inside looking out? Your spirit? When a person dies from cancer, old age, etc., it is the body that dies. Ask anyone, inside they feel they are the same person they were when they were 12, it's the body that gets old and worn out and quits.

When your "one life" is over and your body ceases to function and the "you" that's on the inside (asking these questions) is released, what happens to you? Where will your spirit dwell?

God gave you life. Don't think so? Try holding you breath! Indefinitely!

Answer 5

I don't think you've considered that Man might possibly be damaged to the point that he CANNOT choose God in the first place. That would give us free will all right, but the opposite of what you think is possible, i.e. freedom to make our day-to-day decisions, with the ultimate destruction that we deserve. That explains the nukes and drugs by the way, and disasters and all the bad things in our lives. God could have just left the whole planet in its sins or worse, and just wiped everyone out (he almost did with the flood, didn't he?).

If man is innocent, well, you're left with the dilemma you've proposed, God is stupid for not thinking of what you've thought of, God owes us better than what we've got, etc.

Loved reading the answers and your responses to them.

Answer 6

THE TRUTH OF DESTINY But you will not will unless Allah wills. Lo! Allah is All-Knowing, All-Wise. (Qur'an, 76:30) As a result of experiments he performed in 1973, Professor Benjamin Libet, a neurophysiologist at the University of California, revealed that all our decisions and choices are set out beforehand, and that consciousness only comes into play half a second after everything has been determined.44 This is interpreted by other neurophysiologists as meaning that we actually live in the past and that our consciousness is like a monitor which shows us everything half a second later. Therefore, none of the experiences we perceive are in real time, but are delayed by up to half a second from the real events themselves. Libet carried out his research by making use of the fact that brain surgery can be performed without the use of narcosis, in other words while the subject is fully conscious. Libet stimulated the brains of his subjects with small electrical currents, and when they experienced a perception that their hands had been touched the subjects said that they had felt that "touch" almost half a second before. As a result of his measurements, Libet arrived at the following conclusion: All perceptions are normally transmitted to the brain. As these are subconsciously evaluated and interpreted, the ego is unaware of anything. The information that appears before our minds, in other words that we can be aware of, is transmitted to the cortex, the seat of consciousness, after a certain delay.45 The conclusion from this may be summarised as follows: The decision to move a muscle takes place before that decision reaches the consciousness. There is always a delay between a neurological or perceptual process and our becoming aware of the thought, feeling, perception or movement it represents. To put it another way, we can only be aware of a decision after that decision has been taken. In Professor Libet's experiments, this delay varies between 350 and 500 milliseconds, although the conclusion that emerges is in no way dependent upon those figures. Because, according to Libet, whatever the length of that delay-it makes no difference whether it is great or small, whether it lasts an hour or a microsecond-our material life is always in the past. This demonstrates that every thought, emotion, perception or movement happens before reaching our consciousness, and that proves that the future is entirely outside our control.46 In other experiments, Professor Libet left the choice of when the subjects would move their fingers up to them. The brains of the subjects were monitored at the moment their fingers moved, and it was observed that the relevant brain cells went into action before the subjects actually took the decision. To put it another way, the command "do!" reaches the individual, and the brain is readied to perform the action; the individual only becomes aware of this half a second later. He or she does not take a decision to act and then performs that action, but rather performs an action predetermined for him or her. Yet, the brain makes an adjustment, removing any recognition that the individual is actually living in the past. For that reason, at the moment we refer to as "now," we are actually living something determined in the past. As already discussed, these studies manifest the fact that everything happens by the will of Allah, as revealed in Surat al-Insan 30.

Answer 7

The whole point to free will is to make your own choices in life whether they are bad or good. It is your actions here on Earth that determine whether you spend the rest of your time in heaven or in Hell. By the way to be in hell is to be away from God, not feeling his love or grace in your life.

Satan was once the most beautiful angel ever created and he served God. Satan real name is Lucifer which means the Morning Star. He got jealous and wanted to be worshiped and appreciated like God so he caused a civil war in heaven. Those who followed him were cast out and are called Fallon angels (demons)

Supposedly everyone ever created was there that day and witnessed this event and as we go through life we decide which path to follow. It is our choice to chose good or evil.

Answer 8

Everyone has the choice to do good things, be nice to each other and not kill, maim etc etc.
When God gave us free will, I am sure He hoped and expected us to use it wisely.
Man created nukes and drugs and all of these things, and have abused the environment, how can you blame God for it?
or even Satan? I know that Satan influences some things, but people have a choice to resist it and follow God.
I gave birth to my son in hopes of finding happiness in him and him finding it in me. He is three and I am sure as he grows older he will do some things wrong and make me unhappy at times, that does not negate the love I have for him, or the happiness I have felt.

Answer 9

Picture "free will" as a broad canopy under which there are several types of choices. Your question is not about free will in general but about the part of free will that allows us to disobey God.

The answer to your question is that our free will, including the ability to disobey, is a necessary piece of our human equipment. We need to be able to choose right or wrong, so when we choose God, we do it out of our own volition.

In the next stage of our eternal life, in Heaven, we will still retain our free will, but not the part that allows us to disobey. We can choose when and how we obey but not if we obey. We choose now to live this way in the future and thus use our free will to allow God to remove a small part of it in the next life.

Answer 10

Who is to decide what is right or wrong? You mention drugs as being bad, but to a cancer patient in horrible pain smoking pot is a good decision. Theoretically, God gives us free will to decide for ourselves what is right or wrong and does not impose that decision on us. However, in that freedom of learning what is good or evil we often must learn from experience and those experiences are not always good. But also what makes us happy is not necessarily always right.