Kids need to be taught how to properly interact with dogs but shouldn't dog be taught tolerance?

Question

My last question was about kids and dogs, alot of people mentioned that kids sometimes cause bites because of their actions.. such as pulling a dogs tail, poking, prodding hugging etc. But, isnt it our responsibility as dog owners to teach our dogs to tolerate such things and thereby reduce the risk of an aggressive reaction to a childs actions? What I mean is in general from the answers to my previous question I can conclude that most people expect children NOT to do those things around a dog.. I think that is avoiding the issue, isnt it better to train the dog to tolerate such things rather than taking the chance that someone might accidentally provoke the dog and cause a bite? All of my dogs are poked, prodded, blown in the face, pulled tail etc by me on purpose regularly so as to desensitize them to taking offence to such things.. because of that they have a high tolerance and dont react aggressively to such actions. Shouldnt we all make sure to do that to our dogs and reduce the

risk of an aggressive reaction bite provoked by a child doing the same things?
I think expecting no children to ever do that to a dog is silly, I want my dogs to tolerate accept and even enjoy being handled by children. I wouldnt let a child hurt them but I expect them to tolerate any poking, pulling and hugging that a child may give them. Dont you think dog owners should take responsibilty for training their dogs in tolerance?

Grrr!! I am not saying to teach or allow children to abuse a dog I am saying children are inconsistent, irrational and cant be expected to always behave properly and not forget all the things they should do around dogs. I am saying a dog should not bite a kid for pulling its tail, or accidentally poking their eye, or hugging the dog around the neck. I desensitize my dogs to that sort of thing by exposing them to little irritating things like that myself... as a result you could come up pull my dogs tail, poke him in the eye, hug him, pull his fur and blow in his face and all he would do is lick you. A dog not used to those things would bite..

READ THE DETAILS PEOPLE!! YOU ARE NOT LISTENING COMPLETELY!! I never said you should allow children to harass dogs I am saying that children make mistakes they are not mature enough to be as responsible as an adult, sometimes they forget or make a mistake and do pull a dogs tail etc. I am saying that we as dog owners should do everything in our power to ensure that in case of an accident like that our dogs have been desensitized to reacting violently to such stimulus. Get it?? If a child is walking along and starts to fall and grabs a dogs tail instinctively to try and not fall, the dog should have enough tolerance instilled by you to resist the urge simply "react" once they have been trained HOW to react differently. You replace split second reactive instinct with desenstized reaction.. Understand what I mean now???

I dont have children, but I have nieces and nephews and they are all educated about how to act with dogs, not a one of them would purposely hurt my dogs, they know that you dont bug a dog and pull its tail etc for fun. But they are children and small children in particular often cannot have things explained to them in detail or be expected to remember. Kids forget, kids have tantrums, kids sometimes behave badly.. even the best of them. When I said it was "silly" I meant its silly to expect a toddler not to make a mistake and accidentally poke a dog in the eye sometime, or trip and fall on the dog. Accidents happen but we as dog owners can prepare our dogs to react differently when they do happen.

martinamagrace... stop jumping to conclusions.. I DONT HAVE KIDS!! and I certainly dont abuse my dogs. I am highly offended that you would even imply such a thing. I never hurt my dogs EVER. I also take the time to extensively educate my nieces and nephews how to properly interact with dogs and I train my dogs how to interact with kids and I ALWAYS supervise. I ask this have you ever met a dog that snaps if you touch their tail? or ears etc? well I have and its dangerous, that is why I train my dogs to accept such handling, not in a cruel way either. Learn something read what I said dont just jump to a conclusion beforehand. If you knew me you would never say that to me of all people...

Answer 1

Absolutely. Yes, children should learn to be kind to dogs. But you never know what is going to happen, so it's a good idea to teach dogs to accept just about anything that might be thrown at them. We do this in our puppy classes, having students put their fingers in their pups' ears (not all the way down the canal!), pulling - not yanking - tails, grabbing collars, etc., followed up by treats and praise. Some dogs will never accept children, but most can learn to think it's pretty cool when a kid hugs them and kisses them between the eyes. The bonus is that lots of vets and groomers love us, as we make their jobs much easier.

Answer 2

If a dog is properly handled and socialized as a puppy and through out life, he will be more tolerable.

However, this does not mean that kids have any right poking, squeezing, pulling ears or tails, sitting on, riding, laying on, stepping on, or other wise invading the dog's body and space.

While you can help a dog be more tolerant through conditioning and socialization, you can not remove the fact that certain actions, like being stared in the face, grabbed by the neck, pinched, etc trigger natural instincts in a dog. Children need to learn that certain actions are NOT okay and will NOT be tolerated when done to the dog. If parents can't make sure the child will not do these things, and can't supervise, the dog needs to be crated safely in another room, to lessen the risk of a bit or attack.

As you think it is "silly" to expect that no child will ever do those things, it is "silly" as well to expect any dog to tolerate certain things to an extent as well. I mean, I could bite someone's arm every day, and then give them a puppy that will bite them as well. Does that mean they should be tolerant and allow that puppy to use them as a chew toy?

Absolutely not.

Both children and dogs need to be taught, socialized, and properly supervised when together.

I have to add that a dog that bites a child (or anyone) after being poked in the eye would do so as a pain response. I'm sorry, but you can help your dog become tolerant, but pain is pain and when inflicted in the right amount, no "training" is going to squelsh a natural behavior. If I get bit or stung by something, for example, my FIRST response is to smack it!

If you think your dog will always tolerate this behavior, because you have annoyed it numbness, you are sadly mistaken. It's thinking like that, thinking that "My dog would never bite a child, no matter how irritating, or how much pestering, pulling, poking, prodding or discomfort the child causes him, " that gets children bit and disfigured by family pets.

Answer 3

DId you honestly expected people here to see any side other then the dog's? Don't worry, I understand what you say. I have 3 dogs and 2 kids ages 4 and 5. 2 of the dogs are allowed in the house and the kids and the dogs can interact and play together, no problem. I chose those dogs based on my worj requirements and their ability to get alone with my kids. There has never been a single incident in which one of the dogs has ever even looked at the kids wrong. I EXPECT AND DEMAND that these dogs will take any and all crap from my kids or any kids, without ever acting unsocial. My kids know, to the extent that a kid knows, that they need to treat the animal with respect and care, but, they are kids, things happen. Having said that, I don't care what dog and whose dog or whatever dog it is, if it bites my kid, it dies. There will be nothing to discuss. I love my dogs, but I love my kids much much more and there is no dog worth what my kids ever will be. There is not even a comparrison there. Now good luck to you here, and watch for the thumbs down I get. It just proves my point.

Answer 4

A dog, as well as any animal, has the mind frame of a child. If one child is pinching, pushing, or somehow irritating another child, what is that child going to do? It's going to lash back out at the aggressor. Exactly what a dog is doing when it snaps at a child for yanking its ears.

Most of the time the dog isn't biting to hurt. They're trying to give a warning snap to get the kid to back off. Some, however don't realise just how hard they've snapped, OR they've been caused THAT much pain that they're desperate to get away.

You can't solely blame a dog in that situation, especially if it's a naturally unaggressive dog.

Answer 5

If you have the dog from puppy-hood it can be and should be taught tolerance if the owner is non-abusive (you know the difference, but some folks don't).

We have one dog we got from her first owner who was trained well and kindly - very tolerant of everything. We can take her dish away, move her butt to one side to get by her while she's eating, pet her, jostle her, whatever she might look at us like we're crazy, but that's all. Our other we got from the Humane Society - when he's eating from his dish we just have to leave him alone - I think he was teased with his food. Even after 6 years with us he gets all snarly sounding if anyone or anything approaches his food dish while he's eating. He will eat if I sit there with my hand in his dish, but it takes him about five minutes before he stops growling about it. So anyone that comes over at mealtime we tell to leave him alone 'til he's done eating.

A friend adopted a dog that had been abandoned at the groomers. Ginger, we found out was not trustworthy with children. My daughter had been taught how to be good with dogs, but Ginger would still turn and snap at her for no reason. Once she was just walking past her to get another dog treat for her and Ginger grabbed her arm; if she hadn't had her jean jacket on she would have had bite wounds as it was she had bite bruises.

Answer 6

I understand what you are saying. Yes, you should handle the dog, not roughly but to the extent that it is socialized & will not nip at the least touch. However, no dog needs to be roughly poked, prodded or have its tail pulled - doing those things gently while playing may be fun for you & the dog, but know where to draw the line between fun & abuse. Its a fine line, what might be fun to you, might be antagonizing the dog. The real point here is that people MUST supervise their kids when around pets. No ifs, ands or buts. The kid may do something like scream, run erratically, jump on an animal or mishandle it, resulting in the pet scratching or biting. This is not a animal problem, its not even a kid problem, it is an adult superving problem. Do your best to teach the dog social skills & train the dog to sit, lie down, etc. Also teach the kids how to behave around pets & to touch them gently, & above all SUPERVISE. Also, very importantly, if your kids see you poking the dog & pulling its tail - they probably think its ok for them to do that. They will mimic what they see. So you may be setting a very bad example for them. If you think I'm being critical, please view it as constructive criticism, (I hate those words too) but everyone thinks the way they raise their pets & kids is right, but sometimes there are better methods, so just be open to the criticism & see if there isn't validity to it.

Answer 7

Quit trying to defend stupid indifferent parents and bratty vile kids.

There is absolutely no excuse for not teaching children to be kind and gentle to all animals.

While it is scientifically proven that dogs have the measurable IQ of an average 5 year old, there is no disputing the bold fact that DOGS ARE NOT HUMANS. Expecting a dog to act as a human is unfair to the dog.

Quit trying to anthropomorphise dogs. Dogs are dogs. Humans are humans. Humans (presumably) have a higher IQ than dogs and so it is up to the Humans, with their "superior intelligence," to teach their young to be gentle to dogs.

That said, proper socialization is imperative. I have a 3-year-old pitbull who is quite tolerant of children and strangers. He's always leashed when not in his fenced yard. And when Toddler wants to play with him, I tell Toddler to ask his mummy if it's ok. Then I insist that Toddler be gentle when petting my dog. Never do I take my eyes off the both of them to chat with Mummy over something unimportant. Both our babies are more important than what laundry soap to use etc.

Never once has Blue been ugly or aggressive. He lies down and lets Toddler pound away at will. Usually I'm the one to end the play sesson.

This is true when Toddler visits my house. I do not leave Blue and Toddler unsupevised. Not because of what Blue could do to Toddler - rather the other way around.

But then, I'm in charge - not my dog, nor Toddler. That's the way it is.

Oh yes, Blue was voted the coolest dog in the neighborhood at the community fall festival - by the neighborhood children.

Answer 8

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Answer 9

Humans expect an awful lot of their dogs. They generally expect them to ignore their own instincts and are then totally bewildered when their dogs act like DOGS! Yes, I believe that all dog owners should work with their dogs so that the dog is willing to tolerate some small amount of manhandling. However, as many "dog people" have long since figured out, the majority of dog owners are not dog people. They do not understand the importance of obedience training and socialization. Heck, many dog owners don't seem to understand the need to NOT abuse their animals (judging from the number of animal cruelty cases and abused dogs ending up in shelters across the country)!

Since there is no way to accurately tell just by looking at a dog what kind of training or socialization it has had, it is ALWAYS best to train your kids. A lot of dog bites could be avoided entirely if children would simply resist the urge to run up to a dog and touch it without asking permission! Another important fact to point out is that not all bites are aggression. Many bites, especially children, are a result of the dog "disciplining" the child and have no real aggression behind them at all. The dog has been poked in the eye one too many times and simply growling at the child isn't getting the point across and neither is moving away from the child, as far as the dog is concerned the only other option is to snap. It may not be a hard bite, but human skin, especially children's skin, is considerably thinner than dog skin. Or worse yet, the owners have interpreted the dog's warning signals that he's reaching the end of his tolerance as aggression and totally discouraged any form of growling or teeth showing at all. In this case, the dog may bite with no warning at all...because he's been taught not to display any warning signals.

Yes, dogs should be taught to tolerate the kinds of things that young children are likely to do to them. However, children should never be ALLOWED to do these things to dogs. When responsible dog owners desensitize their dogs by poking and prodding them they are usually gentle. The experience is unpleasant for the dog but not painful (if it is, you've crossed the line from desensitization to abuse). When a child does these things, they are often causing the dog very real pain.

Answer 10

No, I don't think so. The dog is an animal. We're supposed to be smarter. Therefore, it's up to us to not do the things we know could provoke a bite. It's not the animal's repsonsibility, it's ours.

I can't think of many ways you can "teach a dog tolerance" anyway, especially not if you have a willful or dominant breed. A dog is either going to be tolerant, or not. Trying to force the dog to endure something it doesn't want to endure is a recipe for disaster (IE: someone getting mauled). If a dog is annoyed or upset or hurt, they have two choices: Go away, or snap at someone. If they continually go away and still get bothered, they obviously have to switch to plan B.

I got bitten on both of sides of my face by the same dog, a year apart. Was it my fault? Of course it was. I may have been a small child but I knew better (at least the second time) than to do what I did. The dog was just being a dog.