When it is about Freedom of Religion, what is most important to you?

Question

If you had to choose one, which would be more important to you, when the subject is freedom of religion:

1. I have the freedom to worship my god/no god
2. My neighbor has the freedom to worship another god than I do

(The reason I ask this, I'm trying to understand why I always see many people claiming God has to be put back in schools. That would automatically mean that also the other 9,999 gods have to be put in schools, because that's what religious freedom means. My prejudiced feeling is that most people who want 'God back in school' also see #1 as the main feature of religious freedom, but I might be wrong)

rap1361: I posted this question on a world wide web. I'm Dutch. Assuming the whole world is American is even more silly than assuming an entire country is Christian.

Answer 1

That'd be #2.

(And yes, I'm going to answer the question from an American point of view, I know you're in another country. ;-) Most of the extremist fundies and the one's who whine about prayer and putting god back into schools do seem to be from the US. )

I realize Christians think that they have the monopoly on prayer and that by putting “prayer back into school” that it’d only be the Christian variety. But they are wrong. If prayer was in school you’d have to be fair about it after all we are a richly diverse society over here in the US, where a great many people believe a great many things.

So what I'd like to know from any Christian reading this is when your child comes home from school and tells about her morning meditation or prayer to Shiva or hymn to Inanna, that's not a problem, is it?

How would Christians react if instead of rallying around the flag poll to say a prayer to Jesus in the morning, it was a prayer to Thor? I seriously would like to know.

Let's keep the barriers between the state and the church firmly in place. No child (and no parent) should be made to feel inferior because they are part of a religious minority or non-religious.

Answer 2

What's most important to me is that both options be avaliable. Yeah, that means that if my God gets to be put back into schools, then so do the other 9,999 churches as well, but that's a price I, for one, am willing to pay.

(The next time you're in a public library in the U.S., go over to the 200's in the non-fiction section, which is the section devoted to religion. That's how things ought to be set up. Unfortunately, a lot of people in the U.S. think that the First Amendment means that *all* religious references have to be stripped from public view, without realizing that the First Amendment really means that they all have to be given equal treatment.)

Answer 3

Well, 1 without 2 is clearly the root of a lot of evil, but 2 without 1 would be a little weird too - like in "I don't mind that I am oppressed, as long as my neighbour gets to do what she likes". Therefore, it would mean that the atheist whose kids are being forced to learn the Bible in school should be at peace with himself, as long as his neighbour Christian can worship her God freely. And I got this hunch that you meant something different. So I'd say that the two should be considered both just as important for the freedom of religion.

Answer 4

There is what I see as the conundrum of freedom, Markyyy. In a democracy at least, number 2 is required to have number 1.

I'm a great fan of freedom, but recognize that mine comes at the expense of putting up with my irritating neighbors. So, one might say that tolerance is the cornerstone of democratic freedom.

Answer 5

that's considerable in that that's meant to sidestep discrimination against religions of all varieties. It additionally prevents government from implementing rules favoring one faith over yet another and enacting rules against faith in ordinary. there is a few gray there additionally, in that as quickly as those of a particular faith want to foster hatred and discrimination of others they declare the "Freedom of religion" enables them to do it. comparable with assurance.

Answer 6

True, if the Christian God is "put back in schools" then so Should Zeus, Allah, Ra, and the Flying Spaggetti Monster.

Answer 7

Thank you for your interest. However,if you are Dutch i would wonder if your own country does not have enough problems to keep your attention occupied. I've been there,all three of the low countries and I've only seen worse vice and exploitation in Bangkok. Perhaps less interest in us? Your country could do with a lot of work.

Answer 8

the freedom to practice my tribal cultural and spiritual beliefs in my country, without the archaic belief of some christians that native ppl are "heathens" because we do not believe in jc.

Answer 9

I believe number two. I think it is very important for everyone to be allowed to follow their own path without persecution.

Answer 10

well it does not take alot to research to see what our founding fathers thought Freedom of Religion should mean. and these quotes are based on just what they thought the USA school system should be based on. should read about Dr. Benjamin Rush the founder of our public schools.



Thomas Jefferson: "The reason that
Christianity is the best friend of government
is because Christianity is the only religion
that changes the heart."

George Washington: "... whereas it is the duty of all Nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey His will, to be grateful for His benefits, and humbly to implore His protection and favor..."

John Jay was the first Chief Justice of he Supreme Court. He said, "Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers. And it is the duty as well as the privilege and interest of a Christian nation to select and prefer Christians for their rulers

lament that we waste so much time and money in punishing crimes and take so little pains to prevent them…we neglect the only means of establishing and perpetuating our republican forms of government; that is, the universal education of our youth in the principles of Christianity by means of the Bible; for this Divine Book, above all others, constitutes the soul of republicanism.” “By withholding the knowledge of [the Scriptures] from children, we deprive ourselves of the best means of awakening moral sensibility in their minds.” [Letter written (1790’s) in Defense of the Bible in all schools in America]
• “Christianity is the only true and perfect religion.”
• “If moral precepts alone could have reformed mankind, the mission of the Son of God into our world would have been unnecessary.”

"Let the children who are sent to those schools be taught to read and write and above all, let both sexes be carefully instructed in the principles and obligations of the Christian religion. This is the most essential part of education”
Letters of Benjamin Rush, "To the citizens of Philadelphia: A Plan for Free Schools", March 28, 1787

here is what Thomas Paine had to say
“ It has been the error of the schools to teach astronomy, and all the other sciences, and subjects of natural philosophy, as accomplishments only; whereas they should be taught theologically, or with reference to the Being who is the author of them: for all the principles of science are of divine origin. Man cannot make, or invent, or contrive principles: he can only discover them; and he ought to look through the discovery to the Author.”
“ The evil that has resulted from the error of the schools, in teaching natural philosophy as an accomplishment only, has been that of generating in the pupils a species of atheism. Instead of looking through the works of creation to the Creator himself, they stop short, and employ the knowledge they acquire to create doubts of his existence. They labour with studied ingenuity to ascribe every thing they behold to innate properties of matter, and jump over all the rest by saying, that matter is eternal.” “The Existence of God--1810”


and George Washington

It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and Bible.”

“What students would learn in American schools above all is the religion of Jesus Christ.” [speech to the Delaware Indian Chiefs May 12, 1779]

and last Noah Webster

In my view, the Christian religion is the most important and one of the first things in which all children, under a free government ought to be instructed...No truth is more evident to my mind than that the Christian religion must be the basis of any government intended to secure the rights and privileges of a free people.”
[Source: 1828, in the preface to his American Dictionary of the English Language

“All the miseries and evils which men suffer from vice, crime, ambition, injustice, oppression, slavery and war, proceed from their despising or neglecting the precepts contained in the Bible.” [Noah Webster. History. p. 339]

“The Bible was America’s basic textbook
in all fields.” [Noah Webster. Our Christian Heritage p.5]

“Education is useless without the Bible” [Noah Webster. Our Christian Heritage p

We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." --October 11, 1798


The general principles upon which the Fathers achieved independence were the general principals of Christianity… I will avow that I believed and now believe that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and attributes of God.”
• “[July 4th] ought to be commemorated as the day of deliverance by solemn acts of devotion to God Almighty.”
–John Adams in a letter written to Abigail on the day the Declaration was approved

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