Who created God? He is timeless, but then doesn't this philosophy make this concept perfectly sensible?

Question

In a recent question someone asked the question "Who created God". One response, and the generally agreed response, was that he is timeless and has existed for ever and always will. Therefore he doesn't require a creator.

In which case, why does the universe require a creator? One theory of the universe is the "steady state" theory, which states that the universe has simply always existed, although in a different shape, and has merely evolved through a process of natural phenomena into the universe we know today. If you can accept God as being timeless and without creator, than surely you can accept this theory? Which does not require you to believe in a universal conciousness, and does away with the "problem of evil", while explaining the creation of the universe completely adequately?

For more information look here:

http://www.schoolsobservatory.org.uk/study/sci/cosmo/internal/steady.htm

I know that the steady state theory has been discredited and surpassed by big bang, but I think believing in steady state theory still preserves a lot of science, whereas beleiving in God and his creation of man throws even more good science out of the window.

And regarding the comment about "theory", everything in science is a theory, but God can't even scrape being a theory.

Answer 1

It's a JEW CONSPIRACY!

Answer 2

You don't even need a steady state theory for this argument. The point is that time and space are linked: if there's nothing, then there's no time. In other words, if you think that everything began with the Big Bang, then so did time. Time has no meaning before the Big Bang. So there's certainly no need to appeal to a creator.

This ultimately all comes down to the question, "Why is there something rather than nothing?" And this question is literally unanswerable, because there can be no answer. Even God isn't an answer, because God is something rather than nothing.

It just happens that there is something. The absolutely awesome fact, which I'm going to repeat here, is that this is as far as we can go. There absolutely can be no answer whatsoever. Some people meditate by contemplating this.

Answer 3

The Steady State model of the Universe was discredited decades ago - it's all "Big Bang - Universe explodes out of Nothing/Void and will eventually collapse, we're all going to do die" these days. Compared to this, the idea of God existing in an eternal Now which spans Eternity is a simple and acceptable concept.

Answer 4

In this day, facts in evidence weigh most heavily on the side of naturalistic explanations for the existence of the world, the universe and life... and I think that Creationists have introduced a fatal flaw into their 'Intelligent Design' arguments by asserting (or implying) that the 'complexity' of the universe demands a 'creator'.

The main argument for the necessity of a creator hinges on 'complexity'; i.e., "... something as complex as the world, the universe and life must have a creator... it is the only thing that makes sense." But, if you think about it (Christians, in general, are not renowned for their critical thinking skills), it makes no sense at all. In fact, the 'designer' argument is a sterling example of the logical fallacy called 'Argument from Incredulity', a subset of 'Argumentum ad Ignorantiam' ('Argument from Ignorance'). It goes something like this: "I can't conceive of (or imagine) how this might have come to be; therefore, God did it."

The argument asserts that something so complex as a pocket watch... or the universe, or life... requires a creator who, of necessity, must be more complex than the creation... otherwise, it would have been impossible for the 'creator' to 'design' it, or create it. But IF complexity requires a more complex creator, THEN the FACT of the creator's complexity demands, of necessity, that it must ALSO have been created by a MORE complex creator. Remember, according to the argument, complexity cannot arise by itself. That being the case, then, we end up with an infinite regression... creation... creator... creation... creator... creation... creator... creation... creator... etc... ad infinitum... ad nauseum... leading to infinite complexity (whatever THAT is). That is impossible... and thus, so is the concept of a creator of the universe... IF the logical argument for a creator is predicated on 'complexity'... which it is. (One way of looking at this... once you get past the creator/designer of this universe... is that each subsequent creator IS the creation of its predecessor. Trying to make sense out of that makes my hair hurt.)

(Readers should take note that 'complicated'... which is what the Intelligent Design' folks mean when they say 'complex'... is a VERY naive definition, and is not at all what scientists and mathematicians mean when they speak of 'complexity'. 'Complicated is the opposite of 'simple'. 'Complex' is the opposite of 'independent'. Complex systems are typically self-organizing and self-adaptive (which certainly doesn't apply to watches), and they typically exhibit 'emergent' properties and behaviors (also does not apply to watches). So, when creationists/IDists say 'complex', they mean 'complicated'. But when I say things like "complexity arises from simplicity", I do NOT mean that "... things get more complicated.")

Also, they can not seem to differentiate between natural systems and human artifacts (eg., a watch):

* A watch is complex (complicated).
* We know that the watch was designed and created by an intelligent agent of greater complexity.
* The universe is complex (complicated);
* Therefore, the universe, of necessity, MUST HAVE BEEN designed and created by an intelligent agent of greater complexity.

That, in a nutshell, expresses the whole of the argument for intelligent design... an exemplar of sloppy, fallacious thinking.

Creationists conveniently ignore, though, the simple observable fact that in natural systems, complexity DOES arise from simplicity, in accordance with elementary natural processes and rules.

(Interested parties should look up "self-organizing complex systems".)

The religionists might get around this dilemma by proposing that some all-powerful, supernatural, universe-creating entity evolved, all by 'himself' (itself?), from simple beginnings; but that proposition self-destructs upon the shoals of their own insistence that their deity is eternal... "always was and always will be."

The answer to the overriding question "Why" might very well be: "No reason. That's just the way it is. Get used to it." Or, maybe: "Just because." However, acknowledging those as possible (even probable) answers is NOT a reason to stop seeking for alternative answers.

The answer to the question "How" is: "We don't know yet, for sure, but we've got some pretty good, pretty interesting ideas... and we've got some really smart people working on it. Maybe we'll figure it out, some day... or, maybe not."

Answer 5

If we accept your steady state theory, then we have to throw science down the drain, for even science decrees the universe was created with a big bang.

What was here before that? I have no idea, you'll have to ask God, after all He was here "In the beginning...".

Answer 6

The key word in everything you said is "theory". Accepting a theory does not make it any more real or true.

No doubt you will be getting a lot of comments that 0other people created God. For the most part they will be speaking of religions created by people in the name of God.

Answer 7

God was created by Gronk the caveman. Gronk was the oldest and wisest caveman in his tribe. One night there was a very bad storm and all the other cavemen came to ask Gronk what was happening. Gronk told them the sky god was angry because he was hungry.
So the cavemen burned some food in the fire to feed the sky god and the next day the storm was gone. All the cavemen were so happy that they gave Gronk food too.

Gronk being old and wise and smart caught on immediately, tell stories about gods and people give food!

Religion was born.

And that is a far more likely scenario than anything you mentioned above.

Answer 8

Few followed journey towards self and experienced it.

They narrated their experiences to the worldly people. Who found it soul stimulating but could not experience the essence. These ignorant people either believed the narrators as God or created not one but different Gods.

Answer 9

it is the place examining the Bible comes into play. (As published in certainly one of your solutions, you do not "choose" to) God, interior the bible, honestly slowed time down. Which, of course, might advise he lives outdoors its parameters. maybe you DO honestly might desire to examine it.

Answer 10

Al Gore.

Answer 11

you are right! You are nothing but bacteria that evolved from nothing to a living thing! Wow! why didn't I think of this sensible truth................you just made my day>>>>>>>>>>>>.