Legitimacy of War in Iraq: What it all comes down to.?

Question

During WWII

We attacked, invaded and occupied Japan because it was japan that attacked the US 12/07/1941

That's as black and white as it gets.

Why black and white?

Because the government that attacked the US was the same one that we fought against.

But my understanding is that congress found "No credible link" between Saddam and Bin Laden in the 911 commision report.

Given this US Congressional conclussion, ON WHAT SOURCE of infrormation do the war proponents counter this congressional rational.

I DONT WANT A TON OF INSULT AND DISRESPECT FROM SOLDIERS - like in my previous question, I JUST [[ HONESTLY ]] want to find out what you know, HOW it is you are so convinced about:

the connection between Bin Laden and Saddam and 9/11.

What website can I go to?
What book can I read?

I DON'T NEED ANY MORE INSULT AND DISRESPECT, I JUST NEED ANSWERS, SO IF YOU ARE GOING TO SPIT ON ME [AGAIN] at that point you are just an amimal with a machine gun

Answer 1

The Ukrainians were eager to provide the United States with documents from their own archives on Soviet arms transfers to Iraq and on ongoing Russian assistance to Saddam, to thank America for its help in securing Ukraine's independence from the Soviet Union, Shaw said.

In addition to the convoys heading to Syria, Shaw said his contacts "provided information about steel drums with painted warnings that had been moved to a cellar of a hospital in Beirut."

But when Shaw passed on his information to the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) and others within the U.S. intelligence community, he was stunned by their response.

"My report on the convoys was brushed off as ‘Israeli disinformation,'" he said.

One month later, Shaw learned that the DIA general counsel complained to his own superiors that Shaw had eaten from the DIA "rice bowl." It was a Washington euphemism that meant he had commited the unpardonable sin of violating another agency's turf.

The CIA responded in even more diabolical fashion. "They trashed one of my Brits and tried to declare him persona non grata to the intelligence community," Shaw said. "We got constant indicators that Langley was aggressively trying to discredit both my Ukranian-American and me in Kiev," in addition to his other sources.

But Shaw's information had not originated from a casual contact. His Ukranian-American aid was a personal friend of David Nicholas, a Western ambassador in Kiev, and of Igor Smesko, head of Ukrainian intelligence.

Smesko had been a military attaché in Washington in the early 1990s when Ukraine first became independent and Dick Cheney was secretary of defense. "Smesko had told Cheney that when Ukraine became free of Russia he wanted to show his friendship for the United States."

Helping out on Iraq provided him with that occasion.

"Smesko had gotten to know Gen. James Clapper, now director of the Geospacial Intelligence Agency, but then head of DIA," Shaw said.

But it was Shaw's own friendship to the head of Britain's MI6 that brought it all together during a two-day meeting in London that included Smeshko's people, the MI6 contingent, and Clapper, who had been deputized by George Tenet to help work the issue of what happened to Iraq's WMD stockpiles.

In the end, here is what Shaw learned:


In December 2002, former Russian intelligence chief Yevgeni Primakov, a KGB general with long-standing ties to Saddam, came to Iraq and stayed until just before the U.S.-led invasion in March 2003.

Primakov supervised the execution of long-standing secret agreements, signed between Iraqi intelligence and the Russian GRU (military intelligence), that provided for clean-up operations to be conducted by Russian and Iraqi military personnel to remove WMDs, production materials and technical documentation from Iraq, so the regime could announce that Iraq was "WMD free."

Shaw said that this type GRU operation, known as "Sarandar," or "emergency exit," has long been familiar to U.S. intelligence officials from Soviet-bloc defectors as standard GRU practice.

In addition to the truck convoys, which carried Iraqi WMD to Syria and Lebanon in February and March 2003 "two Russian ships set sail from the (Iraqi) port of Umm Qasr headed for the Indian Ocean," where Shaw believes they "deep-sixed" additional stockpiles of Iraqi WMD from flooded bunkers in southern Iraq that were later discovered by U.S. military intelligence personnel.

The Russian "clean-up" operation was entrusted to a combination of GRU and Spetsnaz troops and Russian military and civilian personnel in Iraq "under the command of two experienced ex-Soviet generals, Colonel-General Vladislav Achatov and Colonel-General Igor Maltsev, both retired and posing as civilian commercial consultants."

Washington Times reporter Bill Gertz reported on Oct. 30, 2004, that Achatov and Maltsev had been photographed receiving medals from Iraqi Defense Minister Sultan Hashim Ahmed in a Baghdad building bombed by U.S. cruise missiles during the first U.S. air raids in early March 2003.

Shaw says he leaked the information about the two Russian generals and the clean-up operation to Gertz in October 2004 in an effort to "push back" against claims by Democrats that were orchestrated with CBS News to embarrass President Bush just one week before the November 2004 presidential election. The press sprang bogus claims that 377 tons of high explosives of use to Iraq's nuclear weapons program had "gone missing" after the U.S.-led liberation of Iraq, while ignoring intelligence of the Russian-orchestrated evacuation of Iraqi WMDs.

The two Russian generals "had visited Baghdad no fewer than 20 times in the preceding five to six years," Shaw revealed. U.S. intelligence knew "the identity and strength of the various Spetsnaz units, their dates of entry and exit in Iraq, and the fact that the effort (to clean up Iraq's WMD stockpiles) with a planning conference in Baku from which they flew to Baghdad."

The Baku conference, chaired by Russian Minister of Emergency Situations Sergei Shoigu, "laid out the plans for the Sarandar clean-up effort so that Shoigu could leave after the keynote speech for Baghdad to orchestrate the planning for the disposal of the WMD."

Subsequent intelligence reports showed that Russian Spetsnaz operatives "were now changing to civilian clothes from military/GRU garb," Shaw said. "The Russian denial of my revelations in late October 2004 included the statement that "only Russian civilians remained in Baghdad." That was the "only true statement" the Russians made, Shaw ironized.
The evacuation of Saddam's WMD to Syria and Lebanon "was an entirely controlled Russian GRU operation," Shaw said. "It was the brainchild of General Yevgenuy Primakov."

The goal of the clean-up was "to erase all trace of Russian involvement" in Saddam's WMD programs, and "was a masterpiece of military camouflage and deception."

Just as astonishing as the Russian clean-up operation were efforts by Bush administration appointees, including Defense Department spokesman Laurence DiRita, to smear Shaw and to cover up the intelligence information he brought to light.

"Larry DiRita made sure that this story would never grow legs," Shaw said. "He whispered sotto voce [quietly] to journalists that there was no substance to my information and that it was the product of an unbalanced mind."

Shaw suggested that the answer of why the Bush administration had systematically "ignored Russia's involvement" in evacuating Saddam's WMD stockpiles "could be much bigger than anyone has thought," but declined to speculate what exactly was involved.

Retired Air Force Lt. Gen. Thomas McInerney was less reticent. He thought the reason was Iran.

"With Iran moving faster than anyone thought in its nuclear programs," he told NewsMax, "the administration needed the Russians, the Chinese and the French, and was not interested in information that would make them look bad."

McInerney agreed that there was "clear evidence" that Saddam had WMD. "Jack Shaw showed when it left Iraq, and how."

Former Undersecretary of Defense Richard Perle, a strong supporter of the war against Saddam, blasted the CIA for orchestrating a smear campaign against the Bush White House and the war in Iraq.

"The CIA has been at war with the Bush administration almost from the beginning," he said in a keynote speech at the Intelligence Summit on Saturday.

He singled out recent comments by Paul Pillar, a former top CIA Middle East analyst, alleging that the Bush White House "cherry-picked" intelligence to make the case for war in Iraq.

"Mr. Pillar was in a very senior position and was able to make his views known, if that is indeed what he believed," Perle said.

"He (Pillar) briefed senior policy officials before the start of the Iraq war in 2003. If he had had reservations about the war, he could have voiced them at that time." But according to officials briefed by Pillar, Perle said, he never did.

Even more inexplicable, Perle said, were the millions of documents "that remain untranslated" among those seized from Saddam Hussein's intelligence services.

"I think the intelligence community does not want them to be exploited," he said.

Among those documents, presented Saturday at the conference by former FBI translator Bill Tierney, were transcripts of Saddam's palace conversations with top aides in which he discussed ongoing nuclear weapons plans in 2000, well after the U.N. arms inspectors believed he had ceased all nuclear weapons work.

"What was most disturbing in those tapes," Tierney said, "was the fact that the individuals briefing Saddam were totally unknown to the U.N. Special Commission."

In addition, Tierney said, the plasma uranium programs Saddam discussed with his aids as ongoing operations in 2000 had been dismissed as "old programs" disbanded years earlier, according to the final CIA report on Iraq's weapons programs, presented in 2004 by the Iraq Survey Group.

"When I first heard those tapes" about the uranium plasma program, "it completely floored me," Tierney said.

Answer 2

As an American fighting and defending this great country I am sworn to "defend against all enemies foreign and domestic" I do it every day with pride and enthusiasm. As an American I am told it is my duty in the Declaration of Independence "when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security" This is what our country is based upon, seeing what is right or wrong and fixing it. The Constitution says the government will "provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions" Also the bill of rights clearly states "Amendment II A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed." Will I fight? I am fighting, it is my duty and my right. Some people don't seem to realize that the invasion is already happening, the fight is here, the time to fight is now!!!!!!!!

Answer 3

Because the US was given bad information that Saddam was trying to purchase items from Africa to make WMD's, which was proven shortly there after to be fake documents, but instead of taking the time to thoroughly investigate the information, our government chose to barrel ahead and use this "hot" information to drive support for the cause President Bush had. I have no clue if Bin Laden and Saddam are or were ever linked to the attacks. I, like many Americans, was just living my life. Unfortunately, my life has been changed by these events because my husband signed up for the Army in 2004. We, like many Americans, don't support the war, although we support the troops who are just following their orders, as he has served a tour of duty in Iraq recently. I applaud you for asking these questions, as I have no answer that would suit you. If you find a respectable answer, I would love to know.

Answer 4

Iraq was never about Bin Laden. Unprovoked Iraq attacked a sovereign country. For our own interests, we came to the aid of that alley and defeated Iraq, signed a peace agreement with terms and conditions which Saddam repeatedly violated.

Answer 5

I think you are on a good search for understanding. This is the first time the United States has done a large action like this. There was support in government and our military to do this action, now we all wonder was it a mistake. I have always personally thought we were in error and at best shaky ground. It is an interesting experiment to go on the offensive against terrorist. I hope we would go on the offensive to learn what makes the terrorist do what they do. Why would they want to keep it a secret. Many lost lives I want to know why, just like you do.

Answer 6

Actually, after the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor, the first country the US attacked was Algeria. Or maybe Morocco. North Africa, anyways.

That's as black and white as it gets.

Why black and white?

Because the enemy we fought was bigger than just one country, and we fought the enemy where we believed we could beat them. And we were right.

There is one country whose home territory we never attacked with ground forces during all of World War II.

Japan.

Answer 7

It is not just that there was a connection between Bin Laden and Saddam, I think by this point most people believe that was false intelligence. Saddam was a dictator who brutally supressed and murdered his own people. He gassed, gassed!, peope just like Hitler did in WWII. Even as awful as things are now, it was worth it to remove a man like that from power.

Answer 8

don't be afraid baby,,,feel free to ask about any thing.
well,,,this unjustified bloody war is a big dam mistake for no reason what so ever.
this war will not end and stop,and soon will spread out eating green and dry,,,later US will have to get the hell out of there,then all the middle east problems will have to be solved,but by what means,this question will have to be answered,for now no one knows the answer except Israel the main reason of this bloody war,therefore Israel should be ready to pay the price for its crimes all over the world,also Israel with 3.5 million Jews should really think if they will be able to face 500Million angry,red eyes Muslims.
Listen to me Israel you can run but you can not hide,,,I think the whole world realized the dangerous of this State of Terror,,The days coming will answer all questions which could not be solved in the past.so relax and set back,and expect the unexpected.

Answer 9

If you are so concerned with answers why are you asking us for books and websites. Are you too lazy to research the subject yourself...find your own answers? Or is it that you are actually just trying to piss American off and you really don't care about being insulted.

Answer 10

You can find out more about the false intelligence used in his state of the union address to justify invading iraq. The book is called "the italian letter".

Answer 11

Kill or be killed, there's no other way to stop terrorism, thus Bush needs to get some balls and start using our Military to kick the crap out these subhuman scumbag terrorists as swiftly and efficiently as possible.