Atheists and Theists alike?

Question

I am one of the many people that think atheism is a religion also. The only thing that they say is different is that they say there is no proof that God exists.

I ask u, i bought a watch at Wal-mart the other day, now I have never met the man that made my watch, since i have never seen him, is it logical to say he doesn't exist? No, many will say that the watch is proof of a watchmaker, well the world is proof of a creator, you may have never seen Him. but it is not illogical to say that He exists

So, in otherwords i have never seen the watchmaker, but it is illogical to say that he doesn't exist. I have never seen the creator but it is illogical to say that He doesn't exist...

What do you think?

Answer 1

i think that you are right on. But all the proof that you can find will not persuade anyone who wishes to live with eyes blinded.

Answer 2

*bangs head on table* Once *Bang* again *Bang* you *Bang* miss *Bang* the *Bang* point! *Bang*

Ok, so i go and see a rock. Must i then seek a rock-maker to be sure the rock is actually there? What about my pet cat? is there a cat-maker i need to seek out to get a warranty of service? Hows about the air?

The world, is not a watch! It does not need a creator, it can b a by-product of what occurs when stars form and attract cosmic materials around them. Now for everyone who goes on about cogs and order in response to that, we have a word for understanding how the universe works and what rules it follows. We call it Physics. Action and Reaction. Shoot a cannon into a wall, you get debris. Someone comes along a year later and picks it up, are they going to look for a debris maker, that created it in the form he now sees? The universe is old, and volatile, the earth has been cooked, pressured, cooled and smacked up by a ton of junk floating near or through it. We know this because those things leave signs behind. And those things obey certain rules because they are ingrained in the fabric of the universe. Check out quantum foam, Einstein's relativity and String theory, all of them are jsut the latest theories on how our universe work, because it's in-built, photons have a certain mass and weight and speed, the building blocks have limits they cannot exceed, limits which in turn affect how things work and intereact. You don't need a creator for that, things jsut fit a certain way because they cannot fit any other.

Finally, Atheism is not a religion, and you are deluded to think it is. We are like vegetarians, we have made a personal choice and it doesn't relate to anything else. We are not united, attend weekly meetings nor do we have a text telling us what to do.

And if you bought your watch from Wal-mart you better find who built it because it's only going to last a few months before it falls apart on you.

Answer 3

What you are doing is using an "Intelligent Design" argument (a subset of god of the gaps argument). It's flawed. I've explained this a thousand times, so I'll leave it as an exercise for you to look up. One example before I leave this: Say you are very primative, living in the deep Amazon, never having seen modern man, airplanes, anything beyond stone age technology. You find a watch. You would, after much time, probably conclude, using your own aforementioned logic, that this must be a product of the gods. You would obviously be wrong.

It also fails the Ockhams razor test. It introduces much more unexplainedness (in the idea of a creator, who it could be argued must have been created [since you are arguing the universe had to be]) than it answers.

Natural processes we've seen. Self-organizing systems have been seen, studied, and understood.

Invisible, all-powerful dieties haven't been seen.

Answer 4

There is proof that the man who made your watch exists! His payroll slips, his company's insurance forms... tax returns...... There is proof, and if you were really hell-bent on trying to find the watch-maker i am sure that you could! Whereas your god has NEVER shown himself to anyone .... & the only people who claim to have seen/spoke to him are in the story book that you call the bible.

You are comparing a human watch-maker to a make-believe omnipotent being that does not exist. There IS proof that the watch maker exists.... there is not proof that there is some santa claus mystery god who created everything. Looking around does not give you proof that a god exists..... The bible doesn't prove that god exists! The only people who have seen/spoken to him are the characters in this fictional novel called the bible. The people who claim to speak to him are psychotics who use god to further their own personal agendas.

What you call "proof" of an existence of god is only speculation based on this book filled with magic & drama. PROOF is tangible..... Proof is something that can not be refuted by ANYONE! If there is ANY doubt in ANYONE'S mind then the proof is not proof! If you go to court & you give a quote from a book as "proof" that you are innocent of a crime..... While the evidence against you is overwhelming...... It's not going to keep you from going to jail! Whereas, if you have solid evidence to back you up & not hypothetical "i bought a watch from walmart...." situations where your logic (or lack thereof) proves nothing.

Answer 5

Logic does prove the watchmaker exists because there are plenty of facts that tells us human can make watch. Can you say that about god? Give me a god made watch for a proof.

Answer 6

I think it's not a good analogy, seeing as there is only one explanation of how a watch came to exist (a watchmaker) but it has been shown that it is possible for the world to come into existence without a creator

Answer 7

Religion is defined as belief in God or a Higher Power/the Supernatural. Atheists lack this belief, so Atheism is not a religion.

A watch is a tad different than living organisms. And I'm betting, I would be able to find evidence of the man who made the watch if I did a little digging. I could even travel to his country and take a picture of him.

It is totally different with God.... but if you happen to get a picture of him, email it to me. Otherwise, the proof that I have found of a Higher Power is what I will stick with.

Answer 8

You can trace the watch back to an actual human being who "created" the watch. You can follow the history of the watch back to an actual person. More than likely, you can trace the watch back to a company that utilizes machines in the production of the watch. You can then trace those machines back to the actual designer, AN ACTUAL PERSON.
There is absolutely NO WAY to trace the "creation" of the world/universe/humans back to a being of any sort.
Historically, there are many myths that tell of "Creators" with multiple names, multiple creations, multiple religions.
Why is it not feasible to think that Judeo-Christians are wrong?
Just because you have a book that "tells" you doesn't mean it is true. The majority, if not all, of the stories and myths of the Bible were actually "stolen" from other ancient religions, much older than the so-called "inspired, infallible word of God."
Study, research, learn the actual FACTS, TRUTHS, HISTORY of the Bible, Jesus, and "God" and you too will understand why there are so many atheists.

Answer 9

I have saw a watchmaker. But no one has saw your little fairy tail God. You can compare God to a watchmaker all day. If he be real why is he so afraid to show himself? A watchmaker isn't afraid to show himself. Your logic that the universe requires some sort of intelligent design is ridiculous. Things constantly happen by coincidence.

Answer 10

The universe is an extremely chaotic place overall. We live on one little section that is slightly less chaotic, but still quite random and unpredictable. And you want to think that this implies a creator?

I could also point out all the weird stuff on your body (like your appendix) that serve no purpose and would never have been intentionally designed that way. There are literally dozens of examples.

The watch you can find tooling marks and such that show work being done on it. The geology shows things happening naturally.

Answer 11

Oh, please. First:

re·li·gion –noun 1. a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.

Atheism fits none of that definition. Agreement regarding one scientific theory or another (i.e. big bang) is no prerequisite for being atheist.

Second, using your own "logic," would not the existence of God be proof of God's creator? By your logic, God could not have simply always existed... he needed to be made. Why, therefore, could the same not be said of the universe, that is simply has always been?