Questions about Eternal Security?

Question

I have been exploring the eternal security of the Believer debate. It seems to me that if someone believes in the Conditional Security of the Believer then they find scriptures that seemingly back up their point of view, and if someone believes in Eternal Security they also have Scriptures that back up their point.But what I don't see is scripture that clearly refutes the other point without doubt.I still follow the Eternal Security POV.

If I can do anything to blow it then it is Christ + Works. There's nothing that I can do that's good enough to earn salvation. I, a sinner, saved by Grace am in and of myself totally depraved and nothing I do is good enough to earn salvation. The arguments I've heard so far talk that people who believe in Eternal Security keep on sinning, what people who believe in Conditional Security don't? Are you sure you've confessed all your sins? Have you confessed every sin in your thought life? Have you confessed every person you've ever failed to forgive?

Have you confessed everything you have done that you aren't aware that you have done? Have you confessed everything that you were supposed to do but didn't. The list goes on and on. People who believe in Conditional Security keep on Sinning just like people who believe in Eternal Security. If you believe in Conditional security then your life is a life of fear, and then you really trusting in Christ or are you trusting in your own works. It goes around and around. Does God want us to constantly be in fear that we might do this or that and blow it? Even one sin is enough to keep us from heaven. Have you confessed each and every single possible sin? I don't know that it's possible to do so. I'm not in agreement here. I don't think we can ever be good enough, we're always going to fall short no matter how hard we try. Everytime I have confronted someone about their sin, they've never seen it for themselves. They have always been blinded to their own sin.

That's my question to the people who believe in conditional security - what do you do about all the sins that you commit that you aren't even aware of yet? What if you spend all your life painstakingly rid your life of every sin or confess every sin and then you miss something? Then why did Christ die, if we can do it all? If we are faithless HE REMAINS FAITHFUL FOR HE CANNOT DENY HIMSELF. There's plenty of Scriptural arguments that seemingly support BOTH POSITIONS - that's the thing. It is confusing. If I wanted to build up an argument one way I could find Scripture to seemingly back up my case, and same is true for the other way. But what wins in my mind is the fact that Jesus died for the unGodly, in whom I'm chief. Do you think Paul, never sinned again? Are you sure he kept up with every little thing? One thought can cast you into Hell unless you are saved. The bottom line is you can't save yourself. You can't - GRACE doesn't have anything to do with ME doing ANYTHING.

It is all Christ and what HE has done and not ME doing anything.

I would be willing to listen to feedback. I don't know everything. I just can't accept the doctrine of conditional security. For then, who would be righteous enough? Who would ever get to heaven, wouldn't everyone have some sin in their closet keeping them from eternal life? So for me I can't see how it would be valid that it would be conditional, then why did Christ have to die to take my place if I had to do something to get there. It's a free gift. If we are faithless, He remains faithful for He CANNOT DENY HIMSELF. The conditional argument is troubling, at what point is enough enough and then you go to Hell. And would God give you the taste of Heaven and then send you to Hell? but when you got Saved it was in Faith of His ability to save you - not from what you did to get there. IT doesn't seem consistent with salvation.
It's a troubling topic for me. I'm open to ideas, but please consider mine THANKS

Thanks to everyone who responds.
I'm trying to understand both points of view. Like why would we need to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling if we never needed to worry about our salvation anymore. It's quite confusing. Why would it say that He who endures to the end will be saved. What about the people who don't endure. Are they still saved? IF I were God I'd probably make the doctrine of salvation so clear that anyone would know for sure and there would be no questions. But then I'm not God.Obviously. I'm just trying to do the best I can each day. That's all.

sorry about repeating the Deny Himself line - I didn't mean to do that.

Answer 1

Here's a few questions to consider:

In the story of the Prodigal son, did the Father ever stop loving the son? Was there ever a point at which the son couldn't have simply come back? Did the father even require that the son repent, or was it simply that without repentence (seeing the error of his ways) the son "wouldn't" return to his father?

Did Jesus die for "some" of the sins of the world, or all of them? Did Jesus' death/resurrection atone for all sins, past, present and future? Did his death/resurrection atone for only the sins of Christians or for all the worlds' sins? Or does his death somehow atone for only some peoples' sins? Or does it somehow atone for sins one at a time as they occur?

The bottom line is that in the eyes of God you are without sin. Unfortunately, we can't seem to accept Jesus' words and the fact that we are "free" from the penalties of sin. Instead we feel guilt, and allow others (including the church) to manipulate us by playing on our guilt, and we imagine that if we don't do what they say then we will fall out of grace with God. Untrue. Like the prodigal son, the seperation is all in our own mind. God's opinion of us has never and will never change.

Answer 2

Just wanted to answer one of your points about "why would we need to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling if we never needed to worry about our salvation anymore." I know you're talking about Calvinism, but too many people believe that Calvinists make up their own "comfort zone" by saying once saved, always saved.

It's supposed to be a covenant zone rather than a comfort zone. Regenerated believers see where they were heading, and a life of sin doesn't appeal to them anymore. And this is where things get hung up I think, Arminians look at man as thinking that sinning is still OK if we believe that we're always saved. But why would someone who believes in Christ as the son of God, and now has the Holy Spirit working in his heart, want to turn back around to a life away from Christ? Opened eyes don't want to go back to blindness.

Answer 3

If you believe you can lose your salvation and you have to work to keep the gift of God. You never were saved to begin with.
You are a religious. You are on the works program.
You have what is known as the Jesus and program. Jesus and your works.
Jesus and your righteous deeds.
Jesus and your pastor.

You have nothing. You are not even thankful. Why should you thank Him for anything?
You are keeping yourself.

The sheep helping the shepherd mentality.

They should have shot Jacobus Arminius. Perhaps if you listen hard enough you can hear him screaming even now.

Answer 4

I really think that people misunderstand salvation. And I believe that they misunderstand it because of the actions of some people. Jesus said that you can plant a seed on three types of soil. Bad soil in which nothing will grow, sandy soil which will produce a sickly plant, and good soil which will produce much fruit. Those that are sandy soil seem to have found salvation but because they never really committed, just had an emotional experience, they soon fall away. It isn't that they had salvation and lost it, but that they never really had it.

Answer 5

The holy Quran proclaims the divine security for those who act righteously and fear God without any reservation of religious belief.As far as opposing a true prophet is concerned, such people,if they come across, readily accept him but if they have a biased or zero information, they shall be exempt and not questioned for this.Only the wicked, when they come across a prophet and confront.It is imprinted in there nature that they have the tendency to voilate peace, decency and truth.They cannot abstain from this.

Answer 6

I think your right....
Most of the time I just pray: " God, help me."
But when I do this, I know that he already has.