why do only 9% of deployed soldiers actually go outside the wire in iraq?

Question

how do POGs look themselves in the mirror while real soldiers go face danger every single day? what do all you POGs do all day on the internet? do you tell your families how heroic you are while the grunts, sappers, and scouts face our enemies?

if you dont know the term "outside the wire", you havent been in iraq or afghanistan. (been to both).
if you think sapper is an "outdated term", you havent a clue (army and marines go to sapper school, along with a few from other countries). sapper clear all the msr's and asr's in theatre.
if you spout all this obvious info about support, you havent been to iraq because 90% of it is done by private contractors. typically, support soldiers sit at MWR, the PX, or the gym and check IDs.
We would go on long missions through baghdad or mosul and barely see any other coalition troops, besides a few sleeping IAs at checkpoints. Then we'd come back inside the wire and see a three hour wait at MWR. Or have some CSM tell us we cant go to chow because our ACU's are dirty.
If the average american could spend 2 days in Iraq, he/she would be disgusted.
It is an absolute joke. The waste of money is disgusting. BIAP is a city within itself and the only KBR is in charge.

Answer 1

People, if you haven't ever personally deployed before, you don't know how stupid things can get. Just don't say anything.

If you have deployed before, let me come out front by stating I am a two-tour OIF infantry vet from the 101st Airborne. I do not lord it over people. I am personal friends with many of those in my Battalion who perform combat support roles. I do not call people "Pogues" (which, for the record, only stands for "People Other than Grunts"). I am thankful to the medics who ran the aid station, thankful to the mechanics who came out to recover my M1125 whenever I got blown up and spent long hours with me replacing parts and armor; thankful to the people who ran the DFAC for keeping the food fresh alongside KBR and the staff honest; thankful to the aviation guys who did aerial recon and supported us in our Air Assaults; thankful to the combat engineers who swept the roads day in and day out for IEDs alongside us, the personnel clerks who ensured I didn't have pay problems and ensured the Red Cross messages for my friends who became casualties got back home straight. In all seriousness, I am thankful to each and every servicemember who alongside me does an honest job in theater, day in, and day out. I know these people lose as much sleep as I do when they do their jobs right. They deserve respect.

That having been said, I take great offense at those who think they sacrifice as much of their soul as I do or think they can do my job as good as I can. Being rocketed and mortared in the FOB while standing in line at the PX doesn't mean you're infantry. Being rocketed and mortared while advancing under small arms fire in a siege like Najaf or Fallujah means you're infantry. Manning gates and TCPs, performing convoy escort duties, and on occasion beating on some door to question a cowering Iraqi family in the middle of the night doesn't mean you're infantry. Those are MP tasks. Being infantry means you're beating down a door while some bastard behind it is trying to kill you. It means you are at the forefront of the battle and called on to engage in close combat by fire and maneuver on foot. That's infantry. When non-infantry try the same thing, you get what happened to the 507th Maintenance Company. Does that mean other kinds of units can't fight at all? Not at all; that isn't my case. What is stated is that infantry is called on to shoulder a disproportionate burden of the killing and dying in combat, because that is their sole function. It's not in the job description for any other MOS. So if you're combat support, yes, I'm aware you've made sacrifices. Thank you. And you should be aware I've seen more blood and death, have far more blood on my hands and my conscience, and seen more of my own go back home in caskets. Don't try to cheapen what the infantry are called on to do. Ever.

That having been said, let it be known that there are douchebags in all ranks who see it fit to disgrace their country and their uniform. FOB Nazis whose sole business is to enforce AR 670-1 and create salute zones to harass troops, especially those returning from 18+hour burnout missions outside the wire. When I am told I am not allowed into the DFAC because I am ragged from having been hit by two IEDs just a few hours before, I have a right to be upset. When I am told in the dark as I stumble, half-blind and dead tired, to the phone center to tell my loved ones I am alive after a 15-hour patrol that sees my friends become casualties, and get accosted by some jackass 1SG I didn't see because the female I walked by was a CPT (whose rank I didn't see) and I didn't salute her? I have a right to be upset.

When I sit down in the DFAC once in a blue moon and hear whining from the next table about how hard their jobs are, how tough they have it, and they have pristine uniforms, brand new boots, no weapons, and are on their second cup of ice cream? That doesn't inspire respect in me at all.

So before any of you start mouthing off about the "necessity of the long logistical tail" (which is bullshit, our foxhole strength is totally inadequate) and how it takes 20 of the combat support people to keep me out in the field? I'm the one who STAYS OUT IN THE FIELD. All the damn time.

Don't think I'm not grateful to your father or son, husband or lover, who is out there doing a combat support role with pride and distinction. I respect those people immensely. Those from other service branches alo earn my respect.

Those people who aren't doing their jobs, who have a bad attitude about everything, who take advantage of life on the FOB behind the wire to consume drugs and alcohol, gamble, rape other Americans and local nationals, and those who claim to sacrifice as much as, if not more, than those outside the wire while living in the comfort of air conditioning, goto the PX and MWR several times a day while slacking off from work? They deserve nothing but contempt. Don't think they don't exist. They do. To hell with all of them.

Answer 2

I think most everyone else here is right--it's highly unlikely that you're even in the military, let alone an 11b. If you are (and I truly hope you're not), you're probably one of those losers who scrawls this same kind of crap on the inside of every port-a-john in Iraq... and in the same illegible handwriting, no less. I can already tell you that most infantrymen, sappers, and scouts do NOT agree with your childish remarks. The majority of those who do are almost entirely E-4 and below and have an overall ASVAB score of 15 or less.

Another poster put it the most eloquently: the Army, and the military in general, is a team. Grunts, sappers, and scouts are only one of many moving parts that make the entire machine work. You can glorify the tires of a car all you want because that's the only part that touches the road, but the tires wouldn't achieve their primary function WITHOUT THE REST OF THE CAR. All the pieces are vitally and equally important. Not a single person who knows anything about how the military really works could possibly read your question with a straight face.

I went outside the wire all the time when I was deployed, and I did a lot of jobs and performed a lot of duties that stereotypically infantry and other combat-MOS's would perform in a normal combat environment... but Iraq isn't a normal combat environment. If you've actually been there, there's no way you could argue with that. Everyone is in equal danger of being shot, mortared, rocketed, or blown up by an IED. Take that high-and-mighty ego of yours and tell an artillery captain, a supply CSM, a mechanic MSG, an MI major, or an aviation warrant officer and ask them the same question you so wisely just broadcasted on the internet. Do it, really--see what happens!

Answer 3

I am over here right now for 2nd time, the first time I went on convoys all the time, this time I have not even been off post. Now I am in a support unit as I was the first time here. I read some of the other responses and do agree that we are strong because of the logistical support. Howeever KBR and other contractors are taking over that mission, so because of that I believe we all should go outside the wire.
I also believe the number is higher than 9%, i believe it is more like 20%, but either way it is not enough!

Answer 4

before i answer the question, sapper is and outdated term for a combat engineer (yours truly) and a scout does not exist because a scout is part of the grunt unit. And the way u typed, u don't sound like u ever joined the services in general, so what are u talking about.....How does it feel to drink in college when we can't drink for 7 months?
In the Marine Corp, idk about the rest but the marines, they just don't deploy, over 60 maybe over 70 thousand marines have not deployed, aka we don't waste money shipping them over when they could do the same thing in America, and maybe more have had a choice and did or did not deploy. Those that did but were not grunts did security on different bases. Grunts don't live on base so someone has to protect it, that where Marines come in.... So how did we look ourselves in the mirror, well after we shaved, we didn't look in the mirror....we didn't have time.

Answer 5

Sappers In The Wire

Answer 6

let me guess.... you are 12.... your brother is a marine and you read a letter from him... how cute

truth is...

there are no front lines in a modern war
the guy who walks in to clean the office in baghdad could have a bomb...

my buddy was a mechanic... he got stuck in a humvee running ammo to the infantry units

now your scout if doing his job correctly will never fire a shot if he does that means he is in trouble because they are always outnumbered and only cover is to hide

now your POGs are out setting up the communications towers and are easily sniped off... or blown up just driving down the road in their trucks

thier is no safe spot when the enemy could be the guy right next to you they have even had problems with troops blowing up thier own unit.. if you remember that incident (you woulda been about 7 im guessing at the time so prolly not)

and basicly what it comes down to at some point everyones *** is on the line when a mortar could be lobbed into your barracks

now truth is im army infantry but i sure in the hell want those navy pilots on the carriers or those apache pilots to get my radio signal and come in blow the hell outta whoever is shooting at me and they can be nearly anywhere in iraq in 20 minutes

this is only possible because those POGs you talk of dont sit behind a desk they do thier part ussually out in the open reason there has been as many support people killed as those people you mentioned

when you get back from iraq you can lecture them all you want



and as for the other posters... if your husband talks about POGs like that it would be fun to watch them sit behind thier desks and not risk thier lives pilots getting shot down by rpgs remember? MPs guarding prisons and base gates getting hit by car bombs
payroll people.... well they might get a papercut but you would not have a single soldier if thier was no $ involved
and remember they chose to go to the front lines takes alot braver person than me to sit behind a redcross then go into a combat area and pick up wounded
get on utube watch some of those "pog" videos really good one of a medic getting shot in the body armor... calling in his unit they blow the hell outta the guys *then he goes and saves the guys who shot him* oh and i sure in the hell wont take mortuary affairs... one of those support jobs you never hear of

Answer 7

OK i spend enough time outside the wire i am a 11b and i come across people like you all the time its almost no point to explain this but i see you got the skill of writing so i will try every one has a different job over here and different units has different missions so unless your a general you cant change it and i didn't remember someone asking me where i wanted to be its the military get use to it

Answer 8

"OUTSIDE THE WIRE"? I guess you're not aware, but there is no FRONT LINE in Iraq. Our commander just got back from the sand box a few weeks ago. He worked in a "safe" contracts office and several local Iraqis worked there. One Iraqi man in particular was busted for bringing in parts of a bomb every day. If he hadn't been caught, the whole building would have gotten blown up along with everyone in it.
Obviously you haven't been to the sand box, that's why you're talking outta your hind parts.
Now, go back to reading your war comics like a good little boy.
(USN, retired/in-country Viet Nam vet)

Answer 9

sapper is an outdated term?
the enginers we had were saved saved our asses in mosul and rawah and baghdad. they found like 400 ieds (guestimate) and lost more vehicles and men than most of the brigade combined. even their net name was sapper.
our csm told us only 7% go outside the wire.
as far support, please, have you been there? more people at the px than in sector.

Answer 10

You know, you're right... I'll be thrilled to have my son stay home next tour, and you can do without air support, because the Marine Helo's won't have any mechanical or technical support... We'll just close all "inside the wire" services and see what you think then.

Next time, try THANKING those folks who wear their uniform proudly and use their own non-infantry expertise to make your life better in the field. Loser.

Answer 11

Actually i'd like to see where you came up with that 9% number from ?

Did you just make it up to ask this question or do you have any facts to base it upon?

A quick look at the casualty list on CNN sure seems to show alot more than 9% of the casualties are in support units.