Does the Doctrine of Predestination Suggest that God Might Be Evil?

Question

The Calvinist doctrine of predestination (as I understand it) holds that only the elect will be saved: a portion of mankind redeemed by God's grace from the total corruption brought to all mankind by the Fall. The elect are saved through no merit or actions of their own, but only by God's free gift of grace to them. The remainder of mankind is fully depraved and worthy of damnation. Moreover, because grace is irresistable, the question of worthiness or even morality does not enter into it; one cannot 'choose' to be saved, nor can one opt not to be.

But does this doctrine suggest a God who is arbitrary and tyrannical, picking out His favourites at whim? And if it does, would it have any meaning if we were to describe this God as irrational, or even evil? Do Calvinists have a way around this, or do they accept this image of a terrible God?
What do you think?

Answer 1

Hi!

First, let me say the vast majority of Christians do not subscribe to the doctrine you describe. That does not make Calvinism right or wrong; I merely say that so others don't get the wrong impression of Christianity in general.

Second, your description of Calvinism is basically accurate. My only issue with your description is that God is arbitrary or capricious under Calvinism. They would say God deliberately designed every person from eternity past with a specific purpose and with the full knowledge He would use evil to accomplish that purpose. Since God deliberately designed a specific number of human beings for salvation, then by definition He could not be considered arbitrary or capricious.

That notwithstanding, God punishes with everlasting fire the vast majority of the human beings He created through no fault of their own. It does no good for the Calvinist to hide behind "total depravity" since mankind (with the possible exception of Adam) has nothing to do with being depraved.

I also take issue with one of your respondent's insistence that God's omniscience requires this kind of predestination. My knowledge that you will eat chocolate ice cream tomorrow at 7:35 p.m. does not imply you won't freely choose to eat it.

Finally, I think the following passage (among many others) clearly demonstrates Calvinism is not Scriptural:

Matthew 23:37-38
37. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
38. Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Christ is clearly saying that HE is the one Who wanted to gather them under His wings, but THEY refused. Punishment comes because of what they chose.

**Edit**
In addition, Calvin himself stated he shuddered at the implications of his doctrine. He justified it by insisting it is Scriptural and where logic took him.

**Edit Edit**
"Kj..." below writes the following:

"He never did have to save anyone. Predestination then becomes a prerogative and the verses that mention predestination and foreknowledge can then be taken at face value instead of twisted around to accommodate man's perceived ability to choose."

He never did have to create anyone either. What your doctrine says is God created mankind with postmortem, everlasting conscience existence and willed from eternity past to *punish* these souls with everlasting fire for something for which they were NOT responsible!

So, I tie you up and put you in one corner of a room. I prepare breakfast, dinner & supper every day and put each meal on the other side of the room. You eventually starve to death and my defense is you deserved to die because you didn't eat any of the food. See the point? You were tied up by somebody else and the food (salvation) is withheld from you; and for your failure to eat the food, you're going to burn in the Lake of Fire forever and ever. That's the god of Calvin, but not the God of the Bible.

I Timothy 2:1-4
1. I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
2. For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
3. For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4. Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Answer 2

I think your first paragraph is accurate, except I'm not sure whether we can call man "not depraved" after salvation. Without the Holy Spirit working within our hearts, we are right back to our depraved state. This is the "see through a glass, but darkly" of 1 Corinthians 13:12. Fortunately we have the doctrine of Perseverance of the Saints to back us up with this, allowing us to have a relationship that we would not otherwise have.

For your second paragraph, you seem to have switched from a guilty, undeserving mankind to an innocent, deserving mankind, and this is not the case. A guilty Man would make God loving and just in spite of ourselves, tyranny can only occur with innocence. How terrible is it to toss all of guilty Man into an eternal punishment? I'd call it righteous. He never did have to save anyone. Predestination then becomes a prerogative and the verses that mention predestination and foreknowledge can then be taken at face value instead of twisted around to accommodate man's perceived ability to choose.

And this results in a creature who has had his eyes opened, and says "thank you" rather than "why have you made me thus?" (Rom. 9:20).

Answer 3

Often I find that the Calvinist doctrine of predestination goes hand in hand with Replacement theology (God rejected Israel and now favors the church). The problem they have is that God is not finished with Israel and thus they confuse the meaning of the word "elect".

I guess they would teach God hates some and not others.

I think the phrase "God so love the world..." has to be reworded to "God so love some in the world..." to fit with predestination

Answer 4

GOD needs ALL TO BE saved, WHAT DOES GOD GET? Rev.20:a million-6, The one thousand year reign [ 6130 years after devil in Eden ], is Jesus and commonplace resurrected as priest of God and Christ in his one thousand year reign with devil interior the pit. Rev.20:7-10, one thousand years ends, Rev.20:12,13, all were made alive, not greater devil or any like him, what proportion DID GOD loose? the saints as holy ones are on the breadth of the earth [ because of the fact the resurrection has long previous back 6000 years to Abel who died year a hundred thirty ], SAINTS are joined by ability of those coming down from God out of heaven, Rev.21:a million-5, all is made new, 2Pet.3:13; Isa.sixty 5:17,25; Rev.2:7, as promised [ Gen.2:2,4, God rested from coming up day seven, now all is made new, 7130 years after Eden ], Rev.21:8, earth is cleansed, what proportion DID GOD loose? the dominion of the heavens [ new heavenly Jerusalem ], has all in God's kingdom invariably.

Answer 5

I am not sure of Calvinist view of Predestination.

But I believe that God did not choose those who He was going to save (He predestined or pre-determined) but He determined that those who wanted to be saved must seek to be Holy (like Jesus) and that they would be transformed when they died and entered Heaven.

Answer 6

Yes it does at that is one more good reason to believe that is a bogus doctrine and that John Calvin was not really very nice. Peace to all

Answer 7

It sure does.

Predestination is the only reasonable belief, if one believes that God is omniscient. If God is all knowing then predestination is a requirement.

He knowingly creates humans that are destined for hell.

He is either exceedingly cruel or doesn't exist.

Answer 8

No.....

The doctrine of predestination just proves that God is sovereign.

Read Romans 9....some vessels are for honor and some are for dishonor.

Answer 9

Predestination is only this. God is all knowing. He did not decide our fate, we did through our own free will. We choose to accept him into hearts, to guide us in our lives. We are not saved through merit we are saved and our sins are forgiven because he sent his son to die for us. You can CHOOSE to be saved, you can choose to believe. God will not force hiimself on you but you have to accept Him.

Answer 10

LIkely they say that god knows, but we don't so that we should strive to be one of his chosen.