A question to **** with all atheists?

Question

Now, I'm an atheist too but sometimes my brethren annoy me. So I wish to pose you all a question: Can you prove to me that Pluto (the planet) exists beyond the shadow of a doubt?

Now, some of you will likely post pictures, well I say those are fake and have been doctored up and are really some kids ball.

Some of you will say something like "We have scientific data to prove it exists." well I say that too is false and made up. I cannot personally verify it, so I have no reason to believe this farce of a lie of some planet I cannot see.

Some of you will say "You can see pluto in the sky at certain times." well I say that the human eye is weak and anything seen from a telescope cannot be proven.

So, what are you left with? To believe in pluto you only have

1. people telling you it's there.

2. you can see it at certain times if you're lucky.

3. there are pictures of it.


Yes, I know with this logic you can say anything exists, the Fsm, the Ipu.... anything.

Unlike Pluto however, none of those things has any "real" proof. You really have no reason to believe Pluto exists do

you? Unless you have personally touched Pluto you cannot say it is real, and even then, if you tell people that have

never touched it, that it exists, they'll just call you a madman (in a hypothetical situation).


My point: by all normal atheistic belief, you should not believe in anything unless you can prove it's real and personally you cannot prove a lot of things yourself. You cannot prove: God, an afterlife, a soul, Pluto, the moon for crying out loud.


I want answers to my question.


I'll leave you to flame me and call me ignorant.

Answer 1

Pluto is not a planet. I know my God exist because I feel his love all around. There can't be millions of people who feels God's love...and there is nothing there. Faith that he does exist, leads to knowing he does.

Answer 2

You are a (poor) amateur philosopher and an imbecile.

I believe that Pluto is real because there isn't even the tiniest, most insignificant shred of evidence that might in any way indicate to me that it's not. And a great deal of scientific evidence supporting the idea that it is.

Of course, since I also own a 10' Newtonian Reflecting telescope, I am fully able to verify the truth of Pluto's existence myself, if I so choose (and I have). And since you obviously don't know the first thing about astronomy and telescopes, your entire point is irrelevant and meaningless.

God, on the other hand, is almost entirely illogical. And hasn't got even the most meager shred of evidence suggesting that it might possibly exist. And all of science up to this point in time has been steadily eliminating any possible place where God might possibly be hiding. Effectively making it (god) irrelevant and lazy.

Know what this means? It means you fail. At life.

Answer 3

I'm an atheist because I'm a rationalist. I try my best to hold beliefs which are proportional to reason, logic, and evidence. That proportionality must always be within the context of a standard of evidence. Different propositions require different forms of evidence and degrees of evidence in order for us to believe in them. Essentially, when it comes to Pluto, I have more reason to believe that Pluto is indeed a real planet which truly exists in space than to believe that there is a vast conspiracy involving the existence of Pluto. First, there is no motivation for such a wild conspiracy. Secondly, I have no real reason to doubt the validity of photographic and data based evidence surrounding the existence of Pluto. Lastly, there is nothing too spectacular and wildly unusual pertaining to the existence of Pluto that should raise a brow. In all likelihood, the planet exists.

You're arguing for a unreasonably strict level of epistemological skepticism and perfect empiricism. It's just not a practical or meaningful position. Sure, we can't know with absolute certainty that Pluto exists, but it is the most reasonable conclusion given the information and data that we have - evidence does indeed directly point to the existence of Pluto. Belief doesn't require perfect certainty, it merely demands that it be more reasonable that we believe rather than we do not. In the case of Pluto's existence, it is a much greater stretch to deny its existence, than to affirm it.

Answer 4

"Unless you have personally touched Pluto you cannot say it is real". Why stop there ? Can't you also say that just because you THINK you touched it, it doesn't mean it's real ? It always exasperates the hell out of me, how anyone thinks they are gaining anything by pointing out this technicality that we can't be 100% certain of anything except for the mind that could be fooled in believing the physical world exist.
What hypothetical use could this knowledge have ? Knowing that nothing but your mind exist ? Really think about that. The knowledge is worthless. Therefore it's not even worth knowing.

Answer 5

Proof only exists in formal mathematics. In the real world, all we have is 1) evidence, and 2) theories that explain the evidence and allow us to make useful predictions of evidence we will see in the future, and 3) the very powerful tool of falsification when we can demonstrate a theory is wrong because real evidence contradicts its predictions.

There is a lot of good evidence that Pluto exists, that comes from multiple independent sources. The 'theory' that Pluto exists has never been falsified. That allows me to conclude with very high probability that Pluto actually exists. I don't need absolute 100% certainty to allow myself to believe that Pluto exists.

By the way, "belief" and "faith" are NOT synonyms. Faith is belief without evidence. My belief that Pluto exists is not faith, because I rely on a large body of evidence.

Answer 6

A good question! I wish I had a good answer for it, but I don't so I'll give you the best one I have. To be honest, I have never seen the planet Pluto except in photos, really wouldn't recognize it if I saw it, wouldn't know where to look for it if I did have a telescope, and would have to find and take all of the information necessary to locate it in the sky on some degree of faith. Faith in the people who wrote the details of where and what to look for. Everything we do takes some faith, so we have to decide each for ourselves how much confidence we have in any given source of information. In the case of any published astronomical manual, I have no reason to doubt its motive or accuracy. I have no reason to question the motives and logic of anyone who would claim to know for themself that Pluto is real. I have every reason to doubt the accuracy and motive of religious claims, I'm sure you know what they are.

Answer 7

Atheists have brethren, in the same example of followers of Christ? I sinercely doubt that.

For a start, Pluto was discovered through the irregularities of the orbit of Neptune, as the (now unpromoted) planet itself has a peculiar orbit around our sun, allowing Pluto to be within (closer to) the sun than Neptune at certain dates.

This strange orbit has encouraged a 'nemesis' theory, that there is a second sun (closer than alpha centuria) that affects its orbit.

Why do I believe this? Because

1. a lot of people write books saying that it's true. They work it out from their own reasoning, not from myth.

2. You cannot pick up Pluto through an ordinary telescope. It was not discovered by sight!

3. there are pictures of it. Artists' impressions!

Can I prove that it exists? It exists within your perception, therefore it already exists.

Answer 8

Doesn't really matter if Pluto exists or not, it is no life-altering phenomenon. Whereas the requirement to believe in God, considering the consequences, does require some proof for me. I'm not prepared to offer my life into servitude for something as fantastical as God and all the claims contained in the Bible.

Answer 9

Pluto isn't a planet. And are you telling me that everyone's telescope has a smudge on it when it looks in the direction of Pluto (lol)? And look at the second reason you provided "You can see it at certain times if you're lucky". Seeing it pretty much means it's real...

Answer 10

Then I postulate you don't exist. What would make me believe in your existance? Only some comments stored on some server. Those can be faked.
And now don't tell me we could met in RL, because this would contradict your hypothesis, as you could travel to pluto to simply prove it's existence.