For those who support the Iraq war how do you feel when American / British troops commit war crimes?

Question

Such as the baha musa case when the Britsh Army gave permision for soldiers to break the Geneva Convention and commit war crimes
http://www.guardian.co.uk/military/story/0,,1950396,00.html

Why are there so many happy to have others commit war crimes in their name? This is appalling

Why all this talk of terroists? Not every Iraqi is a terroist. You can't call a whole nation that.

Answer 1

War crimes are a stain on the human soul. On those that commit them, and on humanity as a hole.
With out war their would be no war crimes. Are to nations voted in the governments, that sent solders who were ill equipped mentally, to cope with the stresses of battle..
Small wonder these things happen..
I fear we however must assume some responsibility.

Answer 2

The laws of war neither approve nor condemn such acts, which fall outside their scope. However, nations that have signed the UN Convention Against Torture have committed themselves not to use torture on anyone for any reason. Citizens and soldiers of nations which have not signed the Fourth Geneva Convention are also not protected by it (Article 4: "Nationals of a State which is not bound by the Convention are not protected by it".), whether they are spies or terrorists. Also, citizens and soldiers of nations which have not signed and do not abide by the Third and Fourth Geneva Conventions are not protected by them. (Article 2, of both Conventions: "[The High Contracting Parties] shall furthermore be bound by the Convention in relation to [a Power which is not a contracting party], if the latter accepts and applies the provisions thereof". note: emphasis added)

So while such acts are frowned upon, no illegal acts have been committed. Please don't cite the Geneva or Hague conventions without first reading them.

Answer 3

Well there are war crimes and there are war crimes. For example the out of uniform combatants captured on battlefields could be executed on the spot. That does not violate the Geneva convention. It seems a little cheesy to complain about how they are treated after they are captured when they could have been executed on the battle field in full compliance with the Geneva conventions.

You also have to keep in mind soldiers are individuals and get outside the lines. There are American soldiers in prison in the U.S. for getting out of line in Iraq. I wonder how many terrorist are in some terrorist prison camp for violating Geneva conventions. Some how I don't think they police themselves the same way we do.

Answer 4

Any form of crime against the person is unacceptable. However you assume permission was given to commit war crimes. If that were the case I am sure with those who gave the permission would be in the dock. Conspiracy theory's will not do, proof has to be obtained.

In the UK it takes about 2 years to train a police Constable to competent status. and may more years on the beat to get the experience to be able to both uphold the rule of law and conduct themselves in a way acceptable to both there profession and public scrutiny.

The forces are trained to fight and win wars it their job, its what they do. Most are given very basic training in dealing with the public They are not police officers, they are not prison officers. They are used to getting shot at, blown up, and other horrors inflicted on them we can only imagine. Mistakes are made no doubt and some crimes are committed. I don't blame the solder's I blame the politicians who commit to war with no thought of the aftermath, ie infrastructure, policing of a civilian population. The training in the forces is second to none however they can not be trained to be civil police and prison officers overnight. Its not what they joined up for. I am sure that what makes great serviceman might not make a good prison warden or policeman.

Answer 5

I think the Iraq invasion and occupation derived from information presented for justification that subsequently has been proven as falsehood. I'm not happy about the conduct of the American Government. I'm not a citizen of the UK
and have no opinion on British Iraq involvement.
Likewise Spain, Italy, etc. - etc.

Answer 6

Those who commit war crimes should be punished.

But, the accusations of journalists, or the enemy, are not sufficient to convict a person of war crimes --- or so say the courts.

Yes, since there are bad individuals in every society, some will appear in the military. That in itself does not invalidate the war.

Answer 7

If you support war,you are turning a blind eye to the gross indifference that a war machine shows to humanity .A soldier is trained to kill under orders.Some people don't find out that they have a problem with that until they face that situation.Some people take sadistic pleasure in killing under the aegis of the rules of engagement..How a person treats a person who is weaker than them is the truest test of character.In cases of abuse ,serious character flaws become evident.Answering violence with violence is a sign of moral weakness in an individual,how by extension is it different if a state contrives a war with another state that WAS NOT involved in the terrorist plots of 9/11.The people responsible were Saudi -Arabian Nationals whose intent within Saudi-Arabia is to get rid of the ruling class,who are supported by the US.Saudi-Arabia is never mentioned in any of this because the people behind this war,multi-national oil companies have full access to Saudi-Arabia,just as they want full access to Iraq.That is the kind of "democracy" that Bush's cohorts want installed.

Answer 8

Well, you are clearly of a Guardian persuasian, so this should be simple - The war in Iraq is not a bad thing as we have successfully killed Saddam Hussein. Yes, his Tonyness is an idiot and used the wrong reason to go in, but at least something good came out of it.

So, rather than doing your best to undermine peoples sons and daughters who are fighting a war they didn't choose to go to, why not just stop whinging and accept it. Be proud that there are people willing to lay their lives on the line for our freedom...

Incidentally, Do you wear a poppy on November 11th?

Answer 9

Civilians are guilty of all sort of crimes. Soldiers are no different than civilians in that respect
Laws are broken at all levels, in and out of the army. in every country, at every lrvel of authority.
All that we, or anyone else can do is to punish those who break laws.
A soldier breaking an international law is not a reflection on his country inless it's a policy of that army, or if the army lets the crime go unpunished.

Answer 10

the mod itself would not of given permission to break the rules of the Geneva convention, but the officers and soldiers on the ground have to do what they feel is necessary achieve whatever goals/missions they have been set. what you need to ask is how would you of acted in that scenario, and i mean really think about it, not a lets just all talk and it will be fine cos the real world in a theatre of battle is not like that