Why don't Christians seem to understand that the theories of Entropy and Thermodynamics only apply to...?

Question

... closed systems? Since the earth is not a closed system, your arguments that Entropy and Thermodynamics make evolution impossible is a complete lie?

Why is that so hard to understand? Or is it simply the denial that allows you to believe in your god?

Thanks for proving my point Randy. :)

Toosense, how do you know the universe is a closed system, hmmm? Or is that your assumption? You know what they say about assumptions and last I looked, not a single one of us has been to the end of the universe.

mckenzie, "in many ways" doesn't a closed system make. It either is, or it isn't. It isn't.

Answer 1

If they understood it correctly, they'd have to admit that evolution doesn't violate thermodynamics.

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Randy G:

Entropy in the universe is increasing. The energy that creates some small amount of order on Earth is vastly offset by the HUGE amount of entropy released by the sun.

Net entropy gain, universally.

Congratulations on proving Moirae's point.

By the way, if this weren't the case, your car's engine nor your refridgerator would work, both work on the principles of releasing vast amounts of entropy to produce localized order -- mechanical movement, in the case of the car, lower temperature in the case of the refridgerator.

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toosense:

If what you are saying were true, the internal combustion engine would be a physical impossibility.

The fact I have a functioning car proves you wrong.

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marya:

Classic argument from incredulity, "I cannot believe this happened randomly so it didn't." What you believe or don't believe has no bearing on what is true.

Answer 2

Oh Moiraes Fate of great faith!

I definitely believe in microevolution -leave a pair of sparrows on Galapagos island and after 1000 years have a lot of idfferent types pf sparrows there
but macroevolution that these incredibly complicated biological systems have just "evolved" when most mutations seen are harmful, where half evolved products would not make any sense. Belief in macroevolution requires increasing faith as the complexity of biological systems is more revealed.
Having become a Christian through Bible reading and through friends, evolution became an issue much later. Having had to wade through basic human body molecular biology and biochemistry just 2 years ago I was so amazed -how awfully and wonderfully complex our body is -and how belief in evolution here does require a LOT of faith.
When people want to reject Christianity and particularly God and our accountability to HIM they use evolution often -of course to some it is a real issue. But, I think personally that the most hard core evolutionists just don't seem to know their biology very well or it is not updated! I am not a physicist but would the basic laws of entropy and thermodynamics be against creation in some way?

Answer 3

Nonsense. By that argument there ARE no closed systems. There is NOTHING that prevents cosmic rays, magnetic fields, etc. This does not nullify the fact that for certain things, within certain confines, dealing with certain factors, that within limits you can have a closed system.

For all intents and purposes the Earth IS a closed system in many ways. So is an aquarium on your table with regard to certain aspects of it, even though water evaporates and is added, and air circulates through/out/in. The more factors are kept within the system, the more closed it is.

There are no completely closed systems, so both sides of the argument are not well thought out.

Christians have a point. So do those who argue this point.

But only someone who doesn't understand the nature of classification believes that the lines we draw in science (mammals, birds, etc.) are representations of absolute reality rather than convenient ways to help us keep track of everything (platypus).

Also, please don't misuse the psychological concept of denial. It is a very misused word used any time someone wants to call someone else's ideas foolish because they believe their own beliefs rather than yours, when it actually has a very specific meaning. I'd hate for this use of the word to become common usage... .

Answer 4

I disagree with the premise of your question. In fact I believe that the Thermodynamic theories were developed in large part by Christians.

I think you need to be more specific. I assume you are talking about strickly the few Creationist that think the earth is only 6000 years old. Not all Christians.

Answer 5

Most of the can't differentiate between evolution, Big Bang and abiogenesis. Many of the have so shunned science that they lack the base of knowledge that would allow them to understand any of it, they merely spout what they have been told to.

Answer 6

But the universe IS a closed system (as far as we know). So if you argue that the Earth is NOT a closed system because it gets its heat from the sun, then all that you have done is move the problem to another corner of the universe.

Why don't you understand that?

Answer 7

Are your Gods Entropy and Thermodynamics? What a trip!

Answer 8

It is not the earth that is the container in which we all exist; it is the universe. Energy is not created or lost unless you put the God factor in the mix. Random movement results in less order not more. Order deteriorates over time--the reverse does not happen without intelligent direction and supervision.

Answer 9

nobody said evolution wasnt possible ... or that it doesnt even exist ... only that its not how the earth and the present ecosystem came to be ... it was created by God.

Answer 10

Odd... I have never heard that before. I just don't believe in evolution because it is a load of crap!