Using logicial reasoning...can you?

Question

...prove to me that the universe can never have been created by a supernatual being.

If it's not proved by logic, does that mean it can't be true?

Chip..

Disbelief in religion is the reason why I decided to have a relationship with Jesus!

It's not about religion for Christians. It's about a relationship.

"Christianity is the best friend of government because Christianity is the only religion that changes the heart."

-Thomas Jefferson

Answer 1

meh, i believe it was created by a being.
i just dont believe in religions. religions are man made.

well said doug.

Answer 2

One cannot prove the creation of the universe simply because we wern't there when it happened. Logically both creation and evolution theories are illogical and based entirely off of assumption.

The problem with proving that the universe could have never been created by a supernatural being is the fact that there has to be a beginning. Nothing cannot produce something. Since we all know that everything has a beginning - creationism was the easiest thing to believe as humanity developed. This is the problem with evolution - they cannot explain how nothing produces something (matter and the big bang).

In my opinion - if something isn't proved by logic then it can be true eventually. The question: Can man fly? Could not have been proven 400 years ago until now - Man cannot fly by his own means but with tools and mechanics he can. As time goes on - more and more will become proven and thus logical. For example: when we develop steroids and nanotechnology that allows man to fly then X some years from now - man flying can be proven logically. That is the normal growth of our human species.

Answer 3

Sigh... you can't prove a negative... how many more times do we have to go through this tedious argument where the only way the fanatical religious nutters on this site think they can win an argument is by asking non-believers to prove a negative, something which is acknowledged by ALL scholars (including religious scholars) to be impossible. You require someone to use logical reasoning to do something which is illogical.

There is plenty of evidence that the Universe was created in the Big Bang, totally without the assistance of some beardy bloke sat on a cloud or any other religious claptrap. That is the way to prove something - you look for positive evidence. An old dusty book full of contradictions, half truths and total fantasies is NOT proof... so where's your proof?

The Bible doesn't prove the existence of God or the Biblical version of the creation of the universe any more than the Harry Potter books prove the existence of wizards.

If you believe that the Universe was created by God then it's up to you to prove it. Put up or do us all a favour and shut up.

Answer 4

Yes.

Assuming that the Creator is part of the universe. If you don't agree with this assumption, then my argument does not hold, though I can still prove that a Creator is unnecessary.

1. Given that the Creator had to exist in order to be able to create and could not have created itself, this Creator would have to come into existence without the aid of a creator. Here we show that even complex things, like a Creator, are possible without the intervention of a Creator.
2. If the Creator existed, he/she would have to exist SOMEWHERE. Thus, the Universe would have to come into existence before or at the same time as the Creator. Here we show that the Creator could not have Created the Universe.

Let me know if you need more detail.

Answer 5

No, and neither can you prove that it must have been created by a supernatural being. You're just baiting, and usually you avoid that.

When the evidence is insufficient, it is sufficient to say that we just don't know. And no shame falls on anyone willing to say as such.

^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^ ^v^

EDIT:

"Jonathan Rowe mentions some fake quotes in the writings of religious conservatives, including the following:

“The reason that Christianity is the best friend of Government is because Christianity is the only religion that changes the heart”— Thomas Jefferson

Rowe says it hasn’t been debunked. Well, I don’t know how you “debunk” something like that—the man wrote, what, 20,000 letters in his lifetime and saved them all? But I can say that in my ten years of studying Jefferson I’ve never seen anything like this, and it does not sound like Jefferson’s writing style. “Changes the heart” is a phrase I can’t see him using. The phrase does not appear in Bergh’s 19 volumes of Jefferson writings or in the Library of Congress Jefferson papers.....

And as far as Christianity being the “best friend of Government,” Jefferson is the source of the “wall of separation” phrase, right? His brilliant defense of religious liberty in Notes on Virginia speaks for itself."

Quoted from http://sandefur.typepad.com/freespace/2005/01/jefferson_quota.html

Answer 6

Read science books, honey. Of course it's been proved that a supernatural being can't have made the universe... not even a female supernatural. But that's what spirituality is. You believe something no matter how stupid it seems to other, logical, well-educated people. You keep being very dogmatic.

And no offense to anyone who believes in a God(dess).

Answer 7

It only means that we do not have the science or collection of knowledge to understand it. Ancient greeks understood the atom, but those christians supressed it for a couple thousand years. We had to catch up on 2000 years of dark ages. Having blind faith does not prove anything.

Answer 8

Well here we go again with this beat-to-death question.

Using logical reasoning...can you prove to me that santa claus does not exist? If it's not proved by logic, does that mean it can't be true?

Well no it does not mean it can't be true. It means that there is no logic supporting the belief.

Oh, by the way, you can't prove a negative. That's like asking to see a pile of negative 3 gumdrops.

Answer 9

I have to say, I think it's really silly, and rather insulting to other religions to say that christianity is a "relationship" and other religions are "just a religion." I'm sure other people of other faiths feel they have just as strong a relationship with their higher power as you do for yours.

Answer 10

First rule of logic: you can't prove a negative.

The burden of evidence is on you. If you claim that the universe could have been created by a supernatural being, you support that claim.

Answer 11

I can show you evidence that a supernatural explanation is not necessary to explain the creation of the universe, however that is not proof that a supernatural being does not exist nor played any part in its creation.