Have you got tips on how we can sort out aggression between my two dogs?

Question

We have two german shepherds 18 and 14 months. We got Otto when Fritz was 10 months old. It was clear from the start although younger, Otto was the dominant dog. We have left the two of them to work out where they were in the pack and there were many 'disputes' between the two of them but never towards us.
We have re-enforced the pack positions by treating them in ways appropriate to their position and thought the agression from Otto to Fritz would stop. The instances have decreased in number, as time has gone on but their intensity hasn't.
Otto will have a got at Fritz at the slightest misdeamour (ie trying to go out the door before him, he thinks he is getting more attention from us etc) Although noisy the spats have been in the past all noise and bluster but in the last two weeks they have become a little more violent.They get on well rest of time
What can we do to sort the problem out? Should we ignore it and hope they sort it out,or discipline Otto whenever he has a go at Frit

The get on so well the rest of the time, but we are finding it difficult to deal with the time bomb of each incident. The last one we tried to split them up, but getting in the way meant my husband inadvertently got hurt. Both are contrite and deferntial towards all members of the family, other humans and dogs, it is just Otto having a go at Fritz!

The spats last seconds and finding a new home for one of them is the very last resort

Answer 1

Sell one of them it must be driving your neighbours up the wall

Answer 2

Reinforcing the dominant dog's position is correct in everyday activities but you still need to let them both know that fighting isn't acceptable behaviour - you must be in charge whatever their differences.

Letting them fight it out is not an option as they could do each other, or any one who gets in their way again, serious damage.

Your dogs are still quite young and although you and Otto think he is the top dog he may not be too confident with his position and feel the need to keep having a go at Fritz.

The older dog might still be trying to gain control - it isn't always clear which dog starts the confrontation. You might think it starts when Otto gets aggressive but the actual dispute might have been instigated by Fritz.

Sometimes castrating the underdog helps the situation as the so-called top dog doesn't feel so threatened - it's a male thing! To do this you have to be certain which dog is the top dog and it isn't always as clear cut as you might think.

A home visit by a behaviourist might be worthwhile to sort out who is who in the pack and that includes you, your husband and any other family members as well as your dogs. Try the Association of Pet Behaviour Counsellors (APBC) website.

Don't just accept anyone's advice - it could do more harm than good.

I've been through this myself with two male Shepherds of similar age and we did eventually all get on fine!

Answer 3

Your neighbours are ridiculous. It's feces, the ground is where it's supposed to be. Where do they think squirrels or birds do their business. It's impossible to pick up diarrhea. Explain that the best you can to them. Your best option is to move, those people sound like whack jobs. I had a neighbour that actually called the humane society on my cat because when she was out she would do her busniess on their lawn. You can try hosing down the stop where your dog has diarrhea. Or take some concrete from your backyard off and make a small spot of grass so your dog can go there. Your neighbours can't say anything about that. You shouldn't have to make something for your dog to go in your house. As long as it's not in clear view or in direct path of people/child play then there should be no problem. Tell your neighbours this is only a once in a while thing and you'll do what you can do get rid of it but there's not much else you can do. I hope they lay off and relax. Good luck!

Answer 4

Dominance fights between dogs of approximately the same age and sex is unfortunately a very common and difficult to solve problem, which is one of the reasons, most dog professionals (where I come from, at least) advise that there be an age difference of at least two years between dogs and preferably different temper and sex on top of that.

The best solution would probably be to get a qualified dog-ethologist/trainer/whisperer out to look at your dogs and give you advice.

I believe you are doing the right thing in enforcing Otto's position as the dominant dog, but at the same time remember that YOU are the pack leaders, you decide whether they are allowed to fight or not. In my home, my pets are allowed to exhibit dominance behaviour to maintain and establish their ranking, the older animals are also allowed to put the younger ones in place if they step out of line, but fighting and bullying is not permitted.

Your dogs are still young, immature and at a difficult age, you need to guide them toward what you decide is appropriate behaviour. I hope this works out for you. If the problem and fighting only seems to escalate, you migh want to consider giving one of the dogs away.

PS. I just read your husband got hurt seperating the dogs. Since the spats lasts for seconds only, try to break them up by yelling "No." or "Bad" in a deep, commanding voice. Otherwise throwing water or a book or something else at them should do the trick. If you can't avoid grabbing them then go for the hind legs and try to avoid the muzzle area.

Answer 5

Unfortunately you have to be more masterful letting them know that you top dog will not tolerate this kind of behaviour perhaps it is time to take them to classes so that they can learn to tolerate other dogs as well as each other even older dogs can learn and understand what you will accept in behaviour however you have to be a lot more stern. It is for the good of the pack after all so good luck and hope you can get the message across before anyone else gets hurt just persevere-----try different things i.e. dogs hate water in the face so maybe you could get water pistols in different locations or carry one to give that extra persuasion to stop the aggression.

Answer 6

I sympathise totally.
I have 2 female cross Jack Russell/Collies that hate each other too. They are 2½ years old, from the same litter & loved each other until their first season at around 9 months. I had them spayed, which calmed them down but one is still very aggressive to the other. Their "spats" are violent & there has been bloodshed. We have to keep them apart at ALL times.
People say "just get rid of one" but its not that simple, is it? After all, they are part of the family.
I have now been given the address of an Animal Behaviorist by my vet & am hoping it helps.
Good Luck.

Answer 7

Dominant dogs don't always settle their disputes with aggression. If Otto felt confident he would use a look, or just growl. Its Ottos aggression towards Fritz that needs to be stopped, and I agree that you need expert help with this one.
Neutering Fritz or both of them will be your first step.

http://www.apbc.org -Assc. of pet behaviour counsellors.

Answer 8

I think your first mistake was reinforcing Otto's behavior. It's okay for him to be the dominant male, but he thinks that being so aggressive is what YOU want, since YOU are the Alpha. He now thinks that is a good thing to dominate so aggressively. DON'T ignore his behavior. He needs to redirect his aggression. He can still be the dominant male without so much violence.

There is a certain pecking order that any animal needs in order to retain peace within their community. It should be YOU-the Alpha and Otto is SECOND in command. I think Otto thinks HE is Alpha and ranks over you.

I would definitely contact an animal behavioral specialist before something terrible happens to Fritz.

Answer 9

Get a behaviorist to come and help you out as soon as you can. Here's a searchable website with info:
http://www.iaabc.org/consultant_locator_dogs.htm
There really is no substitute for an actual person with experience coming to help you out.
In the meantime, since you are aware of the situations that cause upset, you need to manage your dogs so that they don't have to fight.
Here's a book:
https://www.dogwise.com/ItemDetails.cfm?ID=DTB798
And of course, having them neutered is a great idea! Low-cost neutering is available everywhere - try to contact your local ASPCA or Humane Society.
Good luck, I hope you can solve this situation!

Answer 10

Are they altered? You have 2 male teenagers fighting for dominance. Testosterone is a powerful force. Other than that, my only suggestion is to try to notice when Otto tolerates Frit and isn't aggressive, and reward him for it. Or, for example, if you see Frit start out the door first, interrupt Otto, distract him and praise him quick before he reacts to Frit's transgression. In other words, don't try to teach him not to be aggressive. Think about it as training him to be more tolerant.. It is easier to think of in terms of not jumping on people. If you have a dog that jumps on people, rather than try to teach him not to jump, it is easier to teach him to sit. He can't jump when he is obeying you and sitting.
He is not going to respond well to being chastised for asserting his dominance over Frit because he "knows" that Frit needs punishing when he doesn't show the proper obesiance (sp?) and getting in trouble will just make it more important to him to punish Frit. But you should be able to sucker him into trying to please you by being tolerant if you are alert enough to distract him and reward him before he can show aggression. You'll just have to be consistent and frequent with the reward/praise.

Answer 11

reinforcing the pack position could be the root of all your problems. i have a male and female staffy. they were finding their place in the pecking order as well. the male is older than the female and naturally more dominent personality. my male would draw blood on my female!!! the trick is to make them an even level in the pack. you and husband and kids the leaders, the dogs are EQUALLY second. start by feeding the more dominant dog after the other. after a few days of this feed them at the same time. it wont be long before they get the idea. i must admit i still have to tie them at each ends of the yard when i give them a bone but this is the only time they fight now. the only way i could dicipline oscar for belting up zoe was to immediately tie him up. he thinks he is doing his job but its not safe. a child might end up getting into the centre of it... you cant just let them sort it out themselves! you are the pack leader and even in the wild pack leaders interfere and sort out the situation. if you are fearful of separating them- which i was, get one of those blow horns. noise diversion works as well. these things worked for me and i hope if you try them they will work for you as well.