Can I shoot in this situation?

Question

I'm in the back of a convenience store, picking up some things. Bad guy comes in while I'm there.. brandishing at the clerk to empty the register. I'm carrying ... legally. Can I legally drop him at that point?

OK... further on the hypothetical. The bad guy has a handgun in the face of an 18 year clerk and I hear "give me the money, or I blow your head off, b*****"

Huh?? The burden is on the victim of a strong arm robbery to determine whether the bad guy's gun is REALLY loaded before you can take life-saving defensive action?

Answer 1

You probably could drop him under those conditions! You are protecting yourself, or others, from the threat of deadly force.

Answer 2

For what it's worth I have some concerns with this situation. First of all, brandishing what? Is it a firearm, a knife, a broken bottle, a Barbie doll?
Next concern is what kind of marksmanship training have you had? Are you deadeye Dan world famous crackshot, capable of shooting perfect scores, or are you a typical person (cops included) who is a bit nervous when the possibility of deadly force comes up and may be a little shaky from adrenaline.
Next what are the conditions of your state's concealed carry laws? Are you allowed to do this in the situation you are in. If they prohibit carrying in liquor stores, and that's where you are... Ooops. You have committed a misdemeanor for carrying in the first place, then you shoot someone in the commission of this misdemeanor and all of the sudden, you are looking at a homicide charge.
So, the question has a bunch of legal ramifications which are weighty and you may find you have gone from HERO to ZERO by the time you are done.
The last deadly force incident I was involved in was over a year ago and the district attorney has still not cleared it officially (they like to wait so that the bad guy's family is through being mad about it). This was a large man with a big knife trying to kill a uniformed police officer.
If this kind of incident takes over a year to resolve, think about your potential incident.
I truly feel that when an armed person lawfully uses deadly force even though you may survive you still lose with the trauma, consequences, etc.
So be very careful what you wish for, you may get it someday.

Answer 3

The Go To Guy makes some great points.

Where I live, if I fire in defense where a felony is in progress, I'm entitled to shoot by the laws of the land. I can also legally shoot someone who is, say, lighting a molitiv cocktail and about to throw it at my house. We also have a right to carry and easy to obtain conceal carry laws.

Of course, it's not the grand jury that you should worry about. You'll get off from that for helping the convenience store clerk.

What you SHOULD worry about is the CIVIL issues that will arise. If you don't kill the criminal, you can expect him to sue the pants off of you for medical bills, pain and suffering, etc. EVEN THOUGH HE caused the crime in the first place!

If you DO kill him, you can expect his family to file similar charges against you, including loss of income, grievance, medical and funeral expenses.

So your question is: Is it worth losing everything you have to help a convenience store clerk keep that $500.00 in his register and be a hero - and in the process risk a lawsuit that could potentially make you financially ruined for life?

OR...

Do you save your hero status for your own life?

My question to you would be: How do you know that the gun the robber brandishes is loaded?

Do you know what the courts would do to you for shooting an "unarmed" victim? Again, I wouldn't worry so much about prison, but about your civil litigations sure to follow. Some food for thought, friend.

Answer 4

It may depend on the particular concealed carry laws of your state. I don't believe you can shoot just then, if the gunman is only brandishing.

If I was in that situation, I would shout, "FREEZE! I am armed, drop the weapon!" If at that point, he aims the firearm directly at me or the clerk, I could legally shoot.

Even if you did shoot and it wasn't technically legal, it is still possible to be "no billed," or not indicted, by a grand jury if they felt the shooting was justified under the circumstances.

Answer 5

Depends on your conceal carry law within your state. If your an Officer in that situation ( at least in the state of Illinois ) I would not have to identify myself prior to shooting as long as there was an immediate threat of death or great bodily harm.

I'd shoot the offender. As long as your definition of " brandishing " was of a weapon. You'd be a hero if you hit your mark.

I'd like to add.... in most states lets say your marksmanship is off and you hit the clerk. In this state the suspect when caught gets charged with the armed violence not you because it was the offender's furtherance by committing the crime which precipitated the shoot situation. Gets a little tricky...

With your additional details: I say shoot shoot shoot ! what ya waiting for SHOOOOT ! lol

Answer 6

In New York State, a Police Officer is justified in the use of deadly physical force to prevent the imminent use of deadly physical force against himself, or another person. In the case you describe where the skell is "brandishing" I seriously doubt that there's a Grand Jury in the world that would not rule the shooting justified, and I'd be damned if I'd warn them first if I was not a Police Officer.

Answer 7

I would think that the bad guy's waving a weapon would constitute an imminent threat to yourself and others. Therefore, it would be a justifiable homicide. No jury in the world would send you up the river because you didn't wait until he actually pointed the weapon at you before firing.

Answer 8

I'm not sure, but go ahead. I would think that in this case if the robber has a weapon and is threatening to shoot people, first call the police. If they start shooting, I would think you could shoot them. I am not a lawyer so....... Shoot at your own risk.

Answer 9

Your carry permit proabably excludes publics places like malls, schools, etc. Technically you might be in some trouble but you could argue mitigation.

Answer 10

You would have a defense of others defense as long as you truly believed that the cashier was in IMMEDIATE threat of being shot himself