About symbolic rebirth...?

Question

When a child is born, he/she has no religion, right? Then he/she is baptized, or whatever, and at that point I guess you could say that the child has entered into whatever faith the parents decided. The parents raise the child according to their faith. Now, if the child grows up to be an adult who rejects religion, is that adult not reverting back to the same condition as when he/she was born, and is this not closer to a symbolic "rebirth" than being "saved" by Jesus? The former returns you to your original state, the latter does not, so how, if you "accept Jesus", are you "born again"?

I see. So babies are born sinful, and baptism washes that away. Why be born again, then? That would just return you to your sinful baby state.

OK. So baptizing a child is wrong (I'm sure the Catholic church would disagree, but whatever). So if the child is not baptized, he/she carries original sin all through life until he/she is "born again". Born again to be what?

I guess that, as an atheist, I'll never understand this compex process. I always thought that babies were innocent, pure and undefiled. Just like I thought that there was no such word as "Simplier". You learn something new every day.

Answer 1

I believe babies are born innocent. They have done nothing truly wrong when born, how can we be born with "sins" if we have done nothing to harm anyone? this is another reason why the christain religion makes no sense, why do they blame little babies on being sinful when they have done nothing. They punish and think evil exists in a small child who knows nothing. They punish the innocent which is unjust.

Answer 2

Hi, awareness is a key ingredient. If you are unaware you are doing wrong, is it wrong? I believe all babies are innocent and therefor don't need baptizing, forgiveness ect.. because they are innocent. But when we become aware of our sin, short comings ect.. then there is something to answer for. By saying their is no God you're in turn saying I don't have to answer for my sin. You seem like an intelligent woman but how do you know if you're deceived, if you're already deceived? If you went to an art gallery and saw a beautiful painting and although the artist wasn't present, wouldn't the painting be evidence that there was an artist? When you see a building, isn't the evidence of the building enough to prove their were a designers and builders? When you look around at this amazing world we live in with all its beauty and wonder and all the different life and the complexity of living organisms, the eye and how it receives light and transfers it to the brain that we can see...wow... There has never been a successful experiment to add information to any living thing. Even Darwin admitted that there was no evidence of KINDS in transformation stage to other KINDS. Our great great grand father wasn't some slime on a rock some 500 billion years ago. You are a created being and God loves you. If you seek the truth its there right in front of you. www.harvesterschurch.org

Answer 3

So, Chef Bob's answer seems to say that Christians can't get into heaven until they are "born again" (by consciously accepting Jesus?). Which implies that, baptism or no, babies can't get into heaven as they lack the mental capacity for such a thing. Sounds logical to me. But I hear unbaptised babies only used to go to Limbo, until the Pope put a stop to that and gave them all free tickets back to the pearly gates.

In your face John 3, I guess.

I've only heard the term "born again" to mean an adult (usually an athiest, often following some life changing event such as addiction recovery) who changes their mind and becomes a Christian. The John 3 quote implies this is incorrect usage because every Christian must be "born again".

Does this mean people can stop using the term then? I've always found it such a sappy, blindly enthusiastic phrase. Yes I think it should apply to religious people who become athiests again, even if only for the irony factor.

Answer 4

First, the spiritual birth is not symbolic; it is actual. Read the third chapter of John about that.

Second, A person's position with God has nothing to do with how they were raised! (I can say that, because I was raised atheist!)

Thirdly, what a person chooses to believe as an adult is their business, not that of their parents.

Last but not least, true Christianity is not a religion at all. I detest religion, and I detest that label! Religion is man's way of trying to reach to God; that's why relilgion is so messed up! On the other hand, Jesus is God's way of reaching to man! Christianity is a RELATIONSHIP with a very personal and loving God. I hope you get to know him very soon!

Answer 5

Life is a gift from God, so we aren't born without religion. We are born into the loving arms and care of God until we choose to make a decision of religion for ourselves. At baptism our sponsors declare that in the event of our parents death or neglect of teaching, that they will teach us of the love of God.
Baptism is the washing away of the old Adam and original sin, into a rebirth with Christ as the center of our faith.

Answer 6

AT LAST A TRUTHFUL and SENSIBLE ANSWER!!ChefBob is absolutely RIGHT!!!! A pity that a lot will not understand it.

One thing that I want to make clear to you though is this. Baptizing a child is WRONG. One is NOT BAPTIZED until they reach the age of accountability, which ONLY GOD KNOWS. I do not know how to put it any simpler. The ONLY WAY to GOD is through Jesus Christ.

Answer 7

it is not a symbolic rebirth.
when you were born, you were born of water.....a human birth and you had, from Adam, a sinful nature....
when you are:
"born again"
"born from above"
your old sinful nature is reborn, changed by God, and you take on a new nature, one
more pleasing to God, so that you may enter Heaven.
the old sinful nature is what barred you from Heaven and it is why you needed salvation through Jesus Christ.
when you are "born again" you are "born of the Spirit of God!"
John 3: The Words of Jesus Christ (God in the flesh)
3. "Verily, I say unto thee, except a man be born again, he cannot see the Kingdom of God."
4. Nicodemus saith unto Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?"
5. Jesus answered, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter the Kingdom of God."
6. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again."
16. "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17. For God sent not His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
18. He that believeth on Him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

Answer 8

Ooh, I like that!!