If the wiccan creed is "Do what you will if it harm none**, why are wiccans harming people with their insults?

Question

Maybe because they're full of it, I suppoose. **By the way, the wiccan creed above was just posted by a wiccan - I didn't make it up.**

Answer 1

Ok, I'll start out slow for your benifit.
It takes more than reading the Rede, Not Creed, we're not the Apostles, to understand it. That you do not understand the Rede is perfectly understandable to me, you're not Wiccan. I'll bet you have the same problem understanding the OT, but then you're probably not Jewish either.

Most newbies, neophytes, heckelers (that would be you I'm thinking) and IRABOs know the last part of the Rede, "An Ye Harm None, Do What Ye Will", there is far more to the Rede than that. Your understanding of the Rede, like the Neos is incomplete, it is not something you will find in a book, for good reason.

Quite a few of the folks who call themselves wiccan are eclectic witches, no formal training, a wiccan is far more than your garden variety witch. True Wiccans have studied for years to learn what they know and are the first to admit that they do not know it all.

As with any religion there are thing that are said and things that must be learned, learning requires the want to know for truth and the will to seek out those who know.

Any fool can stand on a corner and poke fun at things they understand so little to get a laugh from the crowd, what the fool forgets is that the crowd is usually laughing at the fool.

Harming people with their insults? Oh please (rolling eyes). There might be some hurt feelings, but Harm? Your attempts at baiting are less than juvenile, they are pathetic.

So what is your problem? Are you feeling less than because there are people who do not feel drawn to join your little club out of fear? Or is it you have run into something that defys your understanding so like most apes you have to yell at it and throw sticks and stones from a safe distance to prove you are not afraid?

Answer 2

Actually, there's the long version of the Rede (NOT "creed"), and the short, and the short is

"An it harm none, do as you will"

(An = provided)

Like many things, this requires some explanation.

1. Notice that this is an "If, then" statement. If you've taken logic courses, you'll be familiar with that.

Here's another example of an "If, then":

If it rains today, then I'll make soup for dinner.

Given just that, what can we say about dinner it if doesn't rain today?

Nothing, really. I may make soup; I may make something else; I may not make dinner at all.

So the Rede says, basically, "If what you're thinking about doing will cause no harm that you can see, go ahead, don't spend any time pondering the ethics of it"

What does the Rede say about harmful actions? Nada. Zip. Not a word.

It does not address purposely harmful actions, nor does it address accidentally harmful actions.

We are left to decide for ourselves if we will intentionally do something harmful. And we know that we will have to deal with the consequences if we so choose.

Unintentional harm is different - it's kind of a grey area. I tend to think that this is an area in which thoughtlessness will produce thoughtlessness.

This is something that most newbies don't know about the Rede - that's because teachers generally don't tell them until they have reached a level of ethical caution that lets the teacher know that the student can understand fully the responsibility involved in doing purposely harmful things. Generally when a student is at this level, there is no real desire to do purposely harmful things, so it's not the threat of return that stops us, it's a desire not to purposely cause harm.

*** And, trust me, anyone who self-identifies as a "Wiccan" but who calls this the "creed" is a new-born baby witch who's maybe dipped into something by Silver Ravenwolf, an IRABO (I Read A Book Once).

2. There is a vast difference between hurting someone and harming them.

3. The point to the Rede also lies in knowing what belongs to you and what belongs to others. There are people who one cannot do anything to or with who will not choose to feel hurt. That is not the responsibility of anyone but the person choosing to feel hurt.

4. The word "will" is purposeful. It doesn't mean "want" or "have the urge to". That's because the Rede is specifically about what one does with intent.

5. The Rede doesn't actually say "Do no harm under any circumstances whatsoever"- we're not so naive that we think that we can avoid doing any harm ever.



And last...well, as people of other religions are known to say about themselves, we're human, and not perfect.

Answer 3

Q. The Wiccan Rede says "An it harm none, do as ye will." Does that mean a Witch can do anything they want and its OK if they justify the action to themselves?

A. An excellent question indeed! and the answer is no... The whole premise of our belief system is based on living in harmony with all things that exist. This includes, but is not limited to the earth, trees, rivers, lakes, oceans, air, and all of earth's creatures, as well as other people without regard to race, color, religion, or sexual orientation.

My interpretation of the Rede tells me that the creative force of the universe has given me an inner voice, or "conscience," which tells me what is right or wrong. It is also this consciousness that connects me to the creator. By listening to this inner voice, (Perhaps I should clarify here. No I do not hear voices, *smile* it is more like something I feel) I try to analyze my impulses and feelings to ensure they are not driven by greed, lust, envy, prejudice or anger. If they are, I try to put them in perspective or discard them all together. I then use common sense and judgment in my actions and accept full responsibility for them. This is not always easy to do, but I try. By keeping these ideals of right and wrong foremost in my mind, as well as seeking to obtain harmony and balance with nature and all living things, I am able to do my best at following the Rede as I go through my day.

This is not to say that Witches are perfect, never do anything wrong, or make mistakes. We are still human. We are aware of, or try to be aware of the karmic return of our actions, and are very careful not to send out negative energy in thought or deed.

Yes, sometimes a Witch will focus an energy form toward someone who needs a psychic zap. This is only done however when a person is consistently doing something very wrong within society and causing a lot of harm to others. If and when a Witch does zap someone, they do so with the full knowledge that it will eventually return to them and there will be a price to pay according to the Law of Three. There are times when we simply must make a personal sacrifice for the good of the whole and shoulder this weight.

When confronted with this type of situation, I prefer to bring this person to the attention of the Goddess, asking her that justice be done according to her will. In this way I am not focusing negative energy towards the individual and therefore am less likely to suffer karmic repercussions.

Answer 4

Can you give an example of a Wiccan hurling insults? If you mean that a Wiccan suggested that someone do some research, that's not an insult.

Answer 5

Ok...so what insults are you referring to? No matter one's belief or religon prefrence...people can be out-right mean. Goes the same with anything. If you know of a wiccan that throws out insults, does that one wiccan represent all wiccans? Not hardly. unless you are very narrow-minded.

Answer 6

Maybe they're tired of being attacked by small minded people.

The Christians have the Golden Rule, of Treating people the way you would like to be treated, and still you see them hurling insults and degrading people.

Why not ask about those people?

Answer 7

"And ye harm none, do what ye will" is the Creed. And we are not "full" of it. Why is anyone insulting people?? I think to many people are blind sided by their religion, and they need to take a step back and look around. No one knows whos religion is right and whos is wrong, so why dont we just stop judging others.

Answer 8

Actual Wicca doesn't use that. That is from a line from an Author when Wicca was young, and subsumed by the 14 year olds who wanted to play witch.

I, on the other hand, have no problem harming anyone. did you kids find the body yet?

Answer 9

There are Osama bin Laden's, Benny Hin's, and other total dumb@sses in every religion.
In THAT case, it is not their religion, but the person, that is wrong.
Sheena

Answer 10

The Rede (creed) sounds better modified like this:

Do what you will if it harms none... unless they hurt you first, then rip out the old Black Magic spellbook and let 'em have it!