Are the crusaders in heaven or hell?

Question

It is my understanding (correct me if I'm wrong) that the crusades, which resulted in the deaths of millions of men, women and children for no other reason than 'not being christan' were carried out by christians who truly believed in god and truly believed the bible justified their acts. In other words, what happens to mass murderers when they genuinely belief they are doing god's will?

Answer 1

This won't answer your question, but your question seems to address something about Christianity that has always left me confused. It's the malleable nature of God/religious practice. At one time, not too long ago, God was a vengeful and jealous God. Best exemplified, probably, by Jonathan Edwards' sermon "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God" in 1741.

Now, it seems that most Christians (protestants, anyway) view God as all-loving, all-forgiving, and instead of a jealous/vengeful diety, it's pressed upon us that we need a personal relationship with our "Heavenly Father."

What happened? Either God changed, or we changed him. Are both views valid? Is it simply a matter of practicing Christianity as it's practiced during the time that you live? If so, then I'd say that the Crusaders are in heaven if any of this even exists. Their expression of their faith was a product of their time and obviously approved by the Catholic hierarchy. If we can worship "our" God by getting into a loving, personal relationship with him, as seems to be the popular way today, then I don't see why they can't worship "their" God by killing infidels, which was the prescribed demonstration of worship and devotion in their day.

Way back in the days of the crusades, I'm not sure what God's tone was supposed to be, but the Crusades were sanctioned by the pope and must have reflected the 11th - 13th centurey views on what God wanted and what made him happy. If God exists, I don't see how he could punish the crusaders for following the church leaders of their day.

Answer 2

Wrong on a few counts. The Crusades were not undertaken to attack those who were 'not being Christian,' and most crusaders were just like any other group of politically-minded individuals. Where do you get the idea that the Crusaders were any more religious than any of your modern politicians and soldiers? In Medieval Europe, religion was not a choice - it was a civil identity that you were born with. To be French was to be Christian, whether you liked it or not, whether you practiced it or not. The inbdividual Crusaders went to the Holy Land in search of wealth, plunder, land and titles of nobility. The Church supported the Crusades as an endeavor to liberate Orthodox and Monophysite Christians and re-establish the four lost patriarchates. The catalyst for the Crusades were acts of aggression carried out by 'Muslims' against Christians.

Are the Crusaders in hell? The ones who killed, raped, and chopped off the hands and feet of innocent men, women and children are probably in hell. The ones who founded hospitals, took in orphans, and rebuilt war-torn communities are probably in heaven. Same thing for the Muslim side of the conflict.

Answer 3

My heavens that's an easy view of it. The Crusades were so much more than just that.

The crusades, in a military sense, were a tardy defensive reaction to 300 years of muslim aggression in europe. Had they not been fought, southern and eastern europe would be a collection of caliphates today. The truth is that we probably never even would have known the Inquisition, as such, absent the muslim conquest of Spain. In actuality, the muslims got as far as south central France before they were finally dirven back into the Iberian Pennensula by Charles Martel. It took another 800 years for europeans to reconquer Spain. For the entire period of the Crusades, europeans were simultaneously fighting muslim invaders on european soil. Some people like to argue about the probable superiority of muslim culture of the period and how Christian europe may have benefited from what peaceful contact there may have been, but the fact remains that they were still invaders. In that kind of atmosphere, it seems natural that europeans would have regarded the muslim takeover of the holy land and subsequent closings of Christian and Jewish holy sites as sufficient pretext for war. I'd have to say that the closing of the holy sites to nonmuslim pilgrims might be worth war in the eyes of some even today. Saladin agreed to open them back up when the siege on Jerusalem was lifted at the end of the third crusade, but by then the die had been cast.

They were certainly religious in aspect, but what else would have united the warring kingdoms of Europe? That was the ultimate problem. The Spanish war against the Moors was mostly a Spanish problem in the eyes of other kings. It took a cultural threat of more universal significance to get them to unite, however temporarily and grudgingly.

While they were certainly, bloody, they were no more so than many other conflicts of the period, and they did not result in the deaths of "millions".

That having been said, there were atrocities commited by both sides, and many of them were driven by the religious subtext of the conflicts.

Christian theology of the period dictated that if the Crusaders died while believing in the divinity of Jesus Christ and in true repentance of their sins, then they are in heaven. You are certainly free to make of that what you will.

Answer 4

>>>It is my understanding (correct me if I'm wrong) that the crusades, which resulted in the deaths of millions of men, women and children for no other reason than 'not being christan' were carried out by christians who truly believed in god and truly believed the bible justified their acts>>>

Well, your "understanding" is wrong, then. It was not nearly as simple as that.

Remember that the Crusades originally were meant to drive the Moslems out of Palestine and the rest of western Asia, where they slaughtered hundreds of thousands and forced the survivors to convert to Islam.

I find it telling that you show no outrage about that -- your only outrage is directed at the alleged "mass murderers" who took part in fighting them.

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Answer 5

At first I thought up this whole answer about how just because you misinterpret the message, doesn't make your actions good, but on the other hand if you really truly believed you were doing the right thing, nah...nevermind God gave people minds to think and the crusaders knew the evil they were committing. they just wanted control of the people and lands and tried using the bible to justify it.

Answer 6

Naturally I think what they did was contrary to the message of Christ, and as such they are definitely put in a difficult position. HOWEVER many of them never were able to read a Bible for themselves, they only knew what their religious leaders said the Bible said. So in that case, maybe God will judge some of them as ignorant. Although they may have been acting contrary to the teachings of Christ, maybe they didn't actually know his true teachings, and as such are blind.............. But God is the judge so my opinion is irrelevant. But IF they are in heaven it is because of their ignorance in not knowing Christ's true teachings, or IF they are in hell it is because they were corrupting Christ's name. However, the ones I would say are in a dangerous position are the ones who called for the Crusades, and claimed that participants would have their sin forgiven for killing infidels. The participants were just sheep that could be led astray, but the supposed shepherds, who truly did wrong by leading their own sheep astray, are the ones who deserve condemnation. The sheep were just following the wrong shepherds.

Answer 7

Yes, they did it with the blessing for both their political and spiritual leaders.
What country, race or religion has not killed, raped, murdered without consent from their political and spiritual leaders?
The difference is that true Christians were commanded to love one another and to preach the Good News of Gods Kingdom.
Man committed these crimes for greed, they did not, and do not have God’s blessings.
Like all of mankind, they died, and if God chooses to forgive them, then they too will have the same hope of living forever on a Paradise Earth when the Resurrection starts.

Answer 8

The great thing is ... We don't have to judge them. GOD will do so. HE has all of those answers. HE knows the heart and soul of each and every person that ever lived. They are not in heaven or hell at this moment. They will be judged at the same time that we are, at Judgment. Have a great evening.
Eds

Answer 9

They were army's they did what their leaders told them and kill what to them was the enemy. They were just soldiers like any other army. It was their leaders that were the crusaders. And of course none of them either went to Heaven or Hell. They just died like every one else when their time came and molded in their grave. And so did the people killed by them. It's long past no need to dwell on it xx

Answer 10

very few of them knew The Truth of The Salvation Message as they only knew the dogma of the roman "church". Most could not read God's Word let alone study it...it is sad to say but most of them probably will not make it to Heaven.

The truth of the crusades was not about any holy quest... it was about control of trade... with "religion" as the excuse.